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PostPosted: Tue Apr 25, 2017 12:41 pm 
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It depends on your yardstick.

Do they claim to be a populist and outsider? Almost every politician does. It's the thing, now.
It depends on how you define populism. Funny thing, Trump campaigned on alt-right right-populism, but may be shedding it for a more mainstream position. Still, his incompetence and corruption aren't going away.
Carter certainly is one many folks consider left populist. But yeah - he wasn't perfect (for the left, I mean) - that's why Ted Kennedy ran against him in 1980. Among other things, he supported the MX Missile program, and yes, some deregulation.

Populism is a strange and problematic thing to define. What is for the people? Some folks claim tax cuts for the uber wealthy benefit the masses. (I think they're lying, but still.)

Until one answers that question, the OP question can't be answered. ;)

Precisely so. Probably FDR or maybe JFK to a degree.

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PostPosted: Tue Apr 25, 2017 12:59 pm 
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Back on planet earth, there's probably a lot of ambiguity regarding "people." Yes populus is the root word of populism, population, etc and refers to the people. The problem with populism seems to be which people are being appealed to.

When anti-globalization started, it was in response to inequality and corporate shenanigans, and it was from the far left. Now, it seems to be white nationalist/isolationist/eliminationist, and come from the far right.

As the wise professor says, it's all in the metrics.

My metric when I wrote what I did was largely economic, and the idea of the most good for the most people. DemocratIC party candidates, at least outside the South they'd made the devil's deal with, tended to measure that by things like poverty rates, middle class employment, and availability of good union jobs providing goods and services that someone without an MBA could actually see. It all went down the shitter with over-deregulation, neoliberalism, and the wrong kind of globalization.

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PostPosted: Tue Apr 25, 2017 1:45 pm 
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I think utilitarianism is a good, if imperfect, yardstick. The most happiness for the most people.

But with caveats, right... one of Bentham's critics famously noted that if 2 adults beat up a little girl and steal her lollipop, you now have 2 happy people and 1 unhappy person, but this doesn't seem like a justifiably moral action. ;)

I guess populist policy would try and increase the happiness of the most people. I don't see many conservative policies that focus on that, or achieve it. Most of those policies seem to benefit the wealthiest elites the most, and then their, uh, stuff, doesn't trickle down.

I guess I view right populism as not the real thing, as it tries to make people hate "elites" that are not really against them (Hollywood liberals, mutant telepathic professors, etc.)

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PostPosted: Tue Apr 25, 2017 2:54 pm 
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Obama...nope he tried his best to pass the TPP. Maybe with Obama we should add the caveat for the American people. As the TPP would have been great for people in third world nations not so much for us.


TPP may have been a very good thing for the people of this country. It may not have. Anybody who says they know what the outcome of TPP would have been is fulla shit. And BTW, there have been positive and negative outcomes from NAFTA. Anybody who says NAFTA has been all good or all bad is also fulla shit.

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PostPosted: Tue Apr 25, 2017 3:16 pm 
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TPP may have been a very good thing for the people of this country. It may not have. Anybody who says they know what the outcome of TPP would have been is fulla shit. And BTW, there have been positive and negative outcomes from NAFTA. Anybody who says NAFTA has been all good or all bad is also fulla shit.


Maybe you can let Obama know what you think of him. ;)

Obama's quote concerning NAFTA in 2008:

"One million jobs have been lost because of NAFTA, including nearly 50,000 jobs here in Ohio. And yet, 10 years after NAFTA passed, Sen. Clinton said it was good for America. Well, I don't think NAFTA has been good for America -- and I never have," he said.

http://www.cnn.com/2008/POLITICS/02/25/ ... ref=nextin

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Hilarious and Spot on by Trump!


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PostPosted: Tue Apr 25, 2017 3:23 pm 
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Jeff Secessionism

Carmen, you just plain rock.

You Go Girl, It Ain't Man's World.


Lol that guy looks like a Keebler Elf

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PostPosted: Tue Apr 25, 2017 6:04 pm 
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Maybe you can let Obama know what you think of him. ;)

Obama's quote concerning NAFTA in 2008:

"One million jobs have been lost because of NAFTA, including nearly 50,000 jobs here in Ohio. And yet, 10 years after NAFTA passed, Sen. Clinton said it was good for America. Well, I don't think NAFTA has been good for America -- and I never have," he said.


So what...you idiot. So Obama said NAFTA was bad. So fucking what. I wasn't particularly happy with half of what Obama said, or did, or mostly didn't do. Obama may have been the greatest bait and switch artist to ever come down the pike. But there was a higher percentage of stuff he did, and stuff he supported than with any other president in my lifetime.

You think I think he was perfect...unbelievable. You're even more the fucking village idiot than I imagined. And do something about your piss-ass reading comprehension you fucking idiot. I've made a hundred posts here about shit he did or didn't do that pissed me off.

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PostPosted: Tue Apr 25, 2017 6:40 pm 
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Lol that guy looks like a Keebler Elf


I like the Pecan Sandies.

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PostPosted: Tue Apr 25, 2017 7:15 pm 
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Here is what the Resident Cons have always failed to understand.

They believe unlike Republicans, Democrats will just fall into line and march off cliff when a Democrat is in the White House. Even when faced with the fact that such things very seldom if every happen.

Obama screwed the pooch on health. He should have gone straight to single payer and the Republican Compromise would have the A.C.A.

Cons believe in group think. Cons are very seldom if ever able to understand that independent thinking leads to consensus....Cons hate consensus.

glen lies out his eye teeth (he knows he is lying) about the Liberals on RFL would cheered HRC if she had pulled 1/3 of shit that Cheeto-Lini has done. glen is perfect example of the ConJob Lemming following the Fascist Draft Dodger off the cliff. glen does not care about anything that he is told.....there is a Repuublican in the White House.....der GroppenFuhrer is many things but he is not a Republican.

Democrats would be the first to demand impeachment IF HRC had done any the vile things 45 has done. Republicans choose to remain silent.

That mentality of keeping silent and accepting the treason of the Cheeto-Bandito will be their undoing. They do not care, the RePuBliKlans won.....that is all that matters.

Be careful of you wish Cons, it will rise up to bite in fat ConJob Ass.

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PostPosted: Tue Apr 25, 2017 7:35 pm 
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Obama did not have the votes for single payer, he does what he does or there is NO nothing now, no ACA, nothing.

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PostPosted: Tue Apr 25, 2017 8:08 pm 
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Obama did not have the votes for single payer, he does what he does or there is NO nothing now, no ACA, nothing.


Democrats controlled both the House and Senate until 2010. Obama had support, but tried to often to compromise with Republicans....and the A.C.A. is not dead....

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PostPosted: Tue Apr 25, 2017 9:18 pm 
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Obama did not have the votes for single payer, he does what he does or there is NO nothing now, no ACA, nothing.



Here is the deal on that. The GOP will push for a vote on things they know they don't have the votes for making their members be on record.

Obama and the Dems did not push for such a vote IMO because so many Dems were not willing to go on record as being either for or against single payer.

He could have pushed for a vote and still used the ACA as a fall back position.

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PostPosted: Tue Apr 25, 2017 9:20 pm 
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Democrats controlled both the House and Senate until 2010. Obama had support, but tried to often to compromise with Republicans....and the A.C.A. is not dead....



I think his main opponent was a Dem Senator from I believe Nebraska but, it might have been a different Midwest state. The guy was just plain no good and was part of the problem not part of the solution.

Single payer is one issue where I am as far left as Sen Sanders. Albeit for different reasons.

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If you could combine Bill C's skill with Obama's morals you would have the perfect President. One just like Ronald Reagan.


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