Hamas fires 7000 rockets at Israel, starting major war

News and events of the day
User avatar
Drak
Posts: 4493
Joined: Sun Oct 24, 2021 3:02 pm

Re: Hamas fires 7000 rockets at Israel, starting major war

Post by Drak »

Hang on. Is someone claiming Trump is the lesser of two evils?
"Some of those that work forces,
Are the same that burn crosses"

- Rage Against the Machine
JoeMemphis
Posts: 1499
Joined: Mon Oct 16, 2023 5:39 pm

Re: Hamas fires 7000 rockets at Israel, starting major war

Post by JoeMemphis »

gounion wrote: Thu Dec 07, 2023 7:08 pm Your opinion ignores the facts. And it showed that you DO disagree with what Brad posted.

So you think that Trump voters really don’t like Trump, they are just voting against Joe Biden? Really?
You speaking for Brad now? When did that start?

I think based on polling there are a lot of voters who vote for Trump because he isn’t Biden and vice versa. Biden knows this and basically said as much in his fundraiser. Vote for me because we can’t let him win.

Just my opinion. You do t have to agree. Brad doesn’t have to agree. It’s a discussion. People will disagree. Be of good cheer.
gounion
Posts: 17255
Joined: Sun Oct 24, 2021 4:59 pm

Re: Hamas fires 7000 rockets at Israel, starting major war

Post by gounion »

JoeMemphis wrote: Thu Dec 07, 2023 7:24 pm You speaking for Brad now? When did that start?

I think based on polling there are a lot of voters who vote for Trump because he isn’t Biden and vice versa. Biden knows this and basically said as much in his fundraiser. Vote for me because we can’t let him win.

Just my opinion. You do t have to agree. Brad doesn’t have to agree. It’s a discussion. People will disagree. Be of good cheer.
Not speaking for Brad. I just think you plainly completely misunderstood his post.

Can you produce that polling? I sure haven’t seen such polling. The polling I see is that a third of this nation backs Trump 1000%.

Your “opinion” is the stuff of pure fantasy. Like saying “I think that Ryan Leaf is the greatest quarterback in NFL history”. Trump controls the Republican Party. I see interviews of people at Trump rallies. They are NOT saying “I can’t stand Trump, but I hate Joe Biden more”.
JoeMemphis
Posts: 1499
Joined: Mon Oct 16, 2023 5:39 pm

Re: Hamas fires 7000 rockets at Israel, starting major war

Post by JoeMemphis »

gounion wrote: Thu Dec 07, 2023 7:29 pm Not speaking for Brad. I just think you plainly completely misunderstood his post.

Can you produce that polling? I sure haven’t seen such polling. The polling I see is that a third of this nation backs Trump 1000%.

Your “opinion” is the stuff of pure fantasy. Like saying “I think that Ryan Leaf is the greatest quarterback in NFL history”. Trump controls the Republican Party. I see interviews of people at Trump rallies. They are NOT saying “I can’t stand Trump, but I hate Joe Biden more”.
Polling is out there. Both candidates have negatives over 50 percent. Specific polling says that majority of voters would prefer neither candidate runs. So make of that what you will. It reminds me of 2016. The lesser of two evils. My opinion. I like it. You don’t have to line it or agree. Who cares? Not that big a deal.
gounion
Posts: 17255
Joined: Sun Oct 24, 2021 4:59 pm

Re: Hamas fires 7000 rockets at Israel, starting major war

Post by gounion »

JoeMemphis wrote: Thu Dec 07, 2023 7:34 pm Polling is out there. Both candidates have negatives over 50 percent. Specific polling says that majority of voters would prefer neither candidate runs. So make of that what you will. It reminds me of 2016. The lesser of two evils. My opinion. I like it. You don’t have to line it or agree. Who cares? Not that big a deal.
Show us that polling. I say you're making it up.

Show me where the 35 percent of Americans that worship Trump don't want him to be the candidate.
Glennfs
Posts: 10315
Joined: Sun Oct 24, 2021 12:54 pm

Re: Hamas fires 7000 rockets at Israel, starting major war

Post by Glennfs »

gounion wrote: Fri Dec 08, 2023 7:22 am Show us that polling. I say you're making it up.

Show me where the 35 percent of Americans that worship Trump don't want him to be the candidate.
https://thehill.com/homenews/campaign/3 ... tion-poll/

44pct of republicans don't want him to run

67pct of democrats don't want Biden to run

https://www.axios.com/2023/09/07/poll-b ... voters-cnn

These 2 guys are the most beatable candidates since Carter ran for reelection
" I am a socialist " Bernie Sanders
gounion
Posts: 17255
Joined: Sun Oct 24, 2021 4:59 pm

Re: Hamas fires 7000 rockets at Israel, starting major war

Post by gounion »

Glennfs wrote: Fri Dec 08, 2023 7:45 am https://thehill.com/homenews/campaign/3 ... tion-poll/

44pct of republicans don't want him to run

67pct of democrats don't want Biden to run

https://www.axios.com/2023/09/07/poll-b ... voters-cnn

These 2 guys are the most beatable candidates since Carter ran for reelection
So help me out here, Glenn, you know you're better at math than I am. That would mean that 56 percent of Republicans - A MAJORITY - DO want Donald Trump to run.

Am I right? Does my math check?
Glennfs
Posts: 10315
Joined: Sun Oct 24, 2021 12:54 pm

Re: Hamas fires 7000 rockets at Israel, starting major war

Post by Glennfs »

gounion wrote: Fri Dec 08, 2023 7:55 am So help me out here, Glenn, you know you're better at math than I am. That would mean that 56 percent of Republicans - A MAJORITY - DO want Donald Trump to run.

Am I right? Does my math check?
It does show that 67pct of democrats are smarter than you.
" I am a socialist " Bernie Sanders
gounion
Posts: 17255
Joined: Sun Oct 24, 2021 4:59 pm

Re: Hamas fires 7000 rockets at Israel, starting major war

Post by gounion »

Glennfs wrote: Fri Dec 08, 2023 8:30 am It does show that 67pct of democrats are smarter than you.
Translation: "I've got nothin'!" :lol: :lol: :lol:

I knew you'd run away from the question. You'll always support Trump.
User avatar
Drak
Posts: 4493
Joined: Sun Oct 24, 2021 3:02 pm

Re: Hamas fires 7000 rockets at Israel, starting major war

Post by Drak »

gounion wrote: Fri Dec 08, 2023 8:42 am Translation: "I've got nothin'!" :lol: :lol: :lol:

I knew you'd run away from the question. You'll always support Trump.
It’s going to be Biden or Trump. The right choice is Biden. Trump plans on being a dictator and plans on finishing the job destroying democracy. He’s openly saying so. Anyone attacking Biden wants what Trump is offering.
"Some of those that work forces,
Are the same that burn crosses"

- Rage Against the Machine
Motor City
Posts: 1802
Joined: Thu Oct 28, 2021 5:46 pm

Re: Hamas fires 7000 rockets at Israel, starting major war

Post by Motor City »

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1RGgwFdC61A
U.S. vetoes UN resolution for cease-fire as Israel ramps up airstrikes in Gaza

The U.S. vetoed a United Nations Security Council resolution that called for a cease-fire in Gaza. The move came as the UN is ramping up already dire warnings of a humanitarian catastrophe if more aid isn't sent into Gaza soon. According to the Hamas-run health ministry, nearly 17,500 Palestinians have been killed and the Israeli air and ground campaign is not slowing down. Amna Nawaz reports.
War crimes and genocide and humanitarian catastrophe bring about condemnation to those engaged in them, what kind of support is it when those things are encouraged, assisted, financed? Is the US policy just to keep that condemnation and hatred in tact, and for its own self serving reasons?
Image
User avatar
Toonces
Posts: 926
Joined: Sun Oct 24, 2021 9:52 pm

Re: Hamas fires 7000 rockets at Israel, starting major war

Post by Toonces »

Motor City wrote: Sat Dec 09, 2023 1:13 am https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1RGgwFdC61A



War crimes and genocide and humanitarian catastrophe bring about condemnation to those engaged in them, what kind of support is it when those things are encouraged, assisted, financed? Is the US policy just to keep that condemnation and hatred in tact, and for its own self serving reasons?
It was an unnecessary exercise. The US government is just cynical pandering to Jewish voters at this point. A UN resolution wouldn't have stopped Israel from continued attacks. They've never let UN resolutions stand in their way before. Joe Biden is not handling this well, outside of political expediency.

And yet, he's still doing much better than Donald would have done, or anything of the Republican hopefuls.
Glennfs
Posts: 10315
Joined: Sun Oct 24, 2021 12:54 pm

Re: Hamas fires 7000 rockets at Israel, starting major war

Post by Glennfs »

Toonces wrote: Sun Dec 10, 2023 9:35 pm It was an unnecessary exercise. The US government is just cynical pandering to Jewish voters at this point. A UN resolution wouldn't have stopped Israel from continued attacks. They've never let UN resolutions stand in their way before. Joe Biden is not handling this well, outside of political expediency.

And yet, he's still doing much better than Donald would have done, or anything of the Republican hopefuls.
In your opinion what should the Israeli government response been after the terrorist attack?
" I am a socialist " Bernie Sanders
Motor City
Posts: 1802
Joined: Thu Oct 28, 2021 5:46 pm

Re: Hamas fires 7000 rockets at Israel, starting major war

Post by Motor City »

UN General Assembly votes overwhelmingly to demand a humanitarian cease-fire in Gaza
The U.N. General Assembly voted overwhelmingly on Tuesday to demand a humanitarian cease-fire in Gaza in a strong demonstration of global support for ending the Israel-Hamas war. The vote also shows the growing isolation of the United States and Israel.

The vote in the 193-member world body was 153 in favor, 10 against and 23 abstentions. The United States and Israel were joined in opposing the resolution by eight countries — Austria, Czechia, Guatemala, Liberia, Micronesia, Nauru, Papua New Guinea, Paraguay.

The support for a cease-fire resolution was higher than for an Oct. 27 resolution that called for a “humanitarian truce” leading to a cessation of hostilities, where the vote was 120-14 with 45 abstentions.

After the United States vetoed a resolution in the Security Council on Friday demanding a humanitarian cease-fire, Arab and Islamic nations called for an emergency session of the 193-member General Assembly to vote on a resolution making the same demand....
Biden takes a tougher stance on Israel's 'indiscriminate bombing' of Gaza
President Joe Biden on Tuesday warned that Israel was losing international support because of its “indiscriminate bombing" of Gaza, speaking out in unusually strong language just hours before the United Nations demanded a humanitarian cease-fire in the Israel-Hamas war.....


....Before Biden's comments at the fundraiser, Netanyahu said in a statement that he appreciated American support and that he'd received “full backing for the ground incursion and blocking the international pressure to stop the war.”

“Yes, there is disagreement about ‘the day after Hamas’ and I hope that we will reach agreement here as well. I would like to clarify my position: I will not allow Israel to repeat the mistake of Oslo. Gaza will be neither Hamastan nor Fatahstan.”....
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JhMF30VLZCA
Netanyahu, Rabin and the Assassination That Shook History | Netanyahu at War
Image
Motor City
Posts: 1802
Joined: Thu Oct 28, 2021 5:46 pm

Re: Hamas fires 7000 rockets at Israel, starting major war

Post by Motor City »

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nDvuhkVgdJ8
The assassination that shattered peace between Israelis and Palestinians

As Israel and Hamas descend further into war, NBC takes a look back at a time where Israelis and Palestinians almost came to peace. Raf Sanchez breaks down the Oslo Accords and the assassination of Prime Minister Yitzhak Rabin.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pxx7Jv_qMbM
Diplomacy, Not War: Daughter of Released Hostage Urges Israel to Reach Deal to Free More Captives

As relatives of hostages held in Gaza urge Israeli lawmakers to use diplomacy, not war, to free their loved ones, we speak to an Israeli peace activist whose 84-year-old mother was released by Hamas in late November as part of an Israel-Hamas hostage swap during the weeklong pause in fighting.

"We are demanding to release all the hostages," says Neta Heiman Mina, a member of Women Wage Peace.

She says Israeli leaders must "put a deal on the table" even if it comes with a "painful price" that includes freeing more Palestinian prisoners, including some accused of violence. "We must bring them home now. There is no time."
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CISotLMO5a8
WATCH: Biden says he doesn't know if Hamas hostages in Gaza tunnels amid reports of Israeli flooding

President Joe Biden said on Tuesday he didn't know whether hostages taken by Hamas were in harm’s way amid reports that Israel had begun flooding the tunnel system below Gaza.

“There is assertions being made that there … are no hostages in any of these tunnels,” Biden told reporters during a news briefing at the White House. “But I don’t know that for a fact.”
Image
Motor City
Posts: 1802
Joined: Thu Oct 28, 2021 5:46 pm

Re: Hamas fires 7000 rockets at Israel, starting major war

Post by Motor City »

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QfyB13FMVyo
We Must Put Pressure on Netanyahu

The United States must do everything it can to put pressure on Netanyahu’s right-wing extremist government to end this disastrous military approach, which is causing such horrific damage to human life in Palestine.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3SeihfcvOOw
Col. (ret) Ann Wright Challenges Weapons Transfers to Ukraine & Israel at UN Security Council

....While various briefers and delegates presented conflicting perspectives, Wright, a retired United States Army colonel and former diplomat, took a different stance. As a civil society representative, she introduced herself as a concerned citizen and taxpayer who resigned from the U.S. Government in 2003 in protest against the Iraq War.

As the Security Council debates the “complexities' ' of arms transfers and their impact on international peace and security, Wright’s testimony emphasizes the importance of addressing the root causes of conflicts and fostering meaningful resolutions. She makes the case that this is not, in fact, a complex issue nor should it be a debate. It is quite simple, more weapons only create more war and prohibit lasting peace.

While the U.S. government pushes for more war, it's on all of us to push for peace.
Image
Motor City
Posts: 1802
Joined: Thu Oct 28, 2021 5:46 pm

Re: Hamas fires 7000 rockets at Israel, starting major war

Post by Motor City »

More than 575,000 Palestinians in Gaza are starving, UN says
More than a quarter of Gaza households face "extreme" hunger, and there is a risk of famine unless access to adequate food, clean water, health and sanitation services is restored, a U.N. report released Thursday warned. More than 575,000 people have exhausted their food supplies and coping capacities and face catastrophic hunger, the Integrated Food Security Phase Classification report said. Cindy McCain, the agency's executive director said the U.N. has been warning of a coming catastrophe for weeks.

"Tragically, without the safe, consistent access we have been calling for, the situation is desperate, and no one in Gaza is safe from starvation,” McCain said.

The recent seven-day pause showed humanitarian aid can flow when the conditions allow, she said. The reopening of the Kerem Shalom border crossing also can help if aid personnel can work safely.

“More than anything, what is needed now is peace," she said. "The world must come together now to save lives.”....
Image
Motor City
Posts: 1802
Joined: Thu Oct 28, 2021 5:46 pm

Re: Hamas fires 7000 rockets at Israel, starting major war

Post by Motor City »

Israeli campaign in Gaza among deadliest, most destructive in recent history, experts say
Israel's military campaign in Gaza since Oct. 7 now ranks among the deadliest and most destructive in recent history, the Associated Press reported.

At more than 20,000, the death toll from Israel's attacks on Gaza has exceeded that of the U.S.-led nine-month campaign to oust the Islamic State group from Mosul in Iraq, which killed around 10,000.

The damage inflicted by Israel is also proportionally greater than the bombing of Germany by the Allies during WWII. Allied attacks on Germany between 1942 and 1945 destroyed around 10% of all buildings in Germany as compared with 33% of buildings that have been destroyed in Gaza as a result of Israeli attacks, U.S. military historian Robert Pape told the AP.

The Israeli attacks have caused more destruction in just over two months than that suffered by Aleppo in Syria between 2012 and 2016 and Mariupol under Russia's recent invasion of Ukraine, according to the AP.
Image
User avatar
ZoWie
Posts: 5108
Joined: Sun Oct 24, 2021 4:39 pm
Location: The blue parts of the map

Re: Hamas fires 7000 rockets at Israel, starting major war

Post by ZoWie »

It's really starting to look like one of those old tragedies where flawed humans try to make history for reasons they consider noble in their own heads, and the result is a stage full of bodies.
"We must remember that we cannot abandon the truth and remain a free nation." --Liz Cheney, Republican, 7/21/22
Motor City
Posts: 1802
Joined: Thu Oct 28, 2021 5:46 pm

Re: Hamas fires 7000 rockets at Israel, starting major war

Post by Motor City »

Israeli airstrikes in Gaza as pope decries 'appalling harvest' of civilians
...“Our message every year on Christmas is one of peace and love, but this year it’s a message of sadness, grief and anger in front of the international community with what is happening and going on in the Gaza Strip,” Bethlehem Mayor Hana Haniyeh said....
No room for Jesus
...The U.N. Office for the Coordination of Humanitarian Affairs said 76 children were among 293 Palestinians killed in the West Bank since Oct. 7. The agency said 2023 has been the deadliest year for Palestinians in the West Bank since it began recording casualties in 2005.....
or women or children
....Egypt released a proposal to end the Israel-Hamas war with a cease-fire, phased hostage releases and the creation of a Palestinian government of experts to administer Gaza and the West Bank, Egyptian officials told the Associated Press on Monday.

The plan includes releasing all remaining hostages in exchange for letting all Palestinians out of Israeli prisons. Nearly 8,000 Palestinians are held by Israel on security-related charges or convictions, according to Palestinian figures. The plan calls for the Israeli military to withdraw from Gaza and the Palestinian militants to halt rocket attacks on Israel.

The proposal was recently worked out with officials in Qatar and presented to Israel, Hamas, the United States and European governments but still appeared preliminary.

Israel’s War Cabinet, including Netanyahu, were expected to meet later in the day on Monday to discuss the hostage situation, among other topics, an Israeli official told the AP, but the person would not say if the parties would discuss the Egyptian proposal....

...Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu told Israeli soldiers during a trip to northern Gaza on Monday he was “extraordinarily impressed” and reiterated sentiments about continuing the military offensive: “Whoever talks about stopping – there is no such thing. We are not stopping. The war will continue until the end, until we finish it, no less.”...
Spreading death and pain and cursing the light.
...Pope Francis blasted the weapons industry and its “instruments of death” that fuel wars as he made a Christmas Day appeal for global peace and between Israelis and Palestinians....
Image
User avatar
ZoWie
Posts: 5108
Joined: Sun Oct 24, 2021 4:39 pm
Location: The blue parts of the map

Re: Hamas fires 7000 rockets at Israel, starting major war

Post by ZoWie »

Some facts have emerged, and they are being covered in much world media. It's all conjecture, but it's interesting. The emerging narrative goes something like this:

Were it not for this war, he would likely be facing corruption charges and whatever they do over there to impeach the top dog. His coalition was falling apart. Now, of course, that's all on hold for the duration.

Convenient timing for what otherwise is the greatest intelligence failure since Pearl Harbor. Literally. That is not a figure of speech or exaggeration.

Netanyahu may, repeat, MAY, have jumped at the chance to save his career and his legacy. The attack literally saved his career. He put in a war cabinet and suspended the normal parliament, which I believe they call the Knesset. This is all conjecture at best, but it's logical conjecture. Unpopular leader facing crisis reboots the situation and uses the resulting war to take dictatorial power. That's a good elevator pitch in anybody's script department.

This is all conjecture, of course, but given what's currently happening in Israel and the disaspora, it's fairly logical conjecture. The historical facts in 30 years might cause the conclusion that it's not Israel's war. It's Netanyahu's war. He went in with the world's support. Those KIDNAPPED posters were being printed out and stuck on half the lamp posts in every city.

Now even POTUS is telling him to knock it off.

----

Whatever happened to LIHOP? Let It Happen On Purpose. It was never fully credible regarding 9/11, which started the previous war in the Middle East, but it's unsettlingly credible now. Did he have intell that something was up and choose to suppress it because there was a chance to save his ass? I don't know. That's the kind of thing they'll discuss in 20 years.

I don't have a clear answer. Like 9/11, it's all speculation. The facts on the ground are still that Israel was attacked, and it went in with the world's support, but when even Biden is saying enough, it has obviously lost it. Today BiBi is all over the Nooz in our faces telling us all to shut up, he's going to keep wiping out civilians and critical protected infrastructure in violation of international law, using the cover story that he's rooting out terrorists.

THAT, at least, is a fact.
"We must remember that we cannot abandon the truth and remain a free nation." --Liz Cheney, Republican, 7/21/22
bradman
Posts: 2543
Joined: Mon Oct 25, 2021 10:03 am
Location: Home of the DFL

Re: Hamas fires 7000 rockets at Israel, starting major war

Post by bradman »

And what was it Bibi and his coalition put at the top of their desire list for the longest time?
I am not a member of any organized political party. I am a Democrat. [Will Rogers]
User avatar
ZoWie
Posts: 5108
Joined: Sun Oct 24, 2021 4:39 pm
Location: The blue parts of the map

Re: Hamas fires 7000 rockets at Israel, starting major war

Post by ZoWie »

The media are going to town on Biden, saying that backing Netanyahu has lost him the youth vote, whatever that is. (They don't vote.)

This seems a bit premature.

In the absence of facts, and the presence of this kind of speculation, and with the increase of the same level of BS that has been getting Republican conspiracy nuts elected nationwide, I regret to inform you that I can find no reliable information to comment further on this matter.
"We must remember that we cannot abandon the truth and remain a free nation." --Liz Cheney, Republican, 7/21/22
JoeMemphis
Posts: 1499
Joined: Mon Oct 16, 2023 5:39 pm

Re: Hamas fires 7000 rockets at Israel, starting major war

Post by JoeMemphis »

ZoWie wrote: Tue Dec 26, 2023 10:36 am Some facts have emerged, and they are being covered in much world media. It's all conjecture, but it's interesting. The emerging narrative goes something like this:

Were it not for this war, he would likely be facing corruption charges and whatever they do over there to impeach the top dog. His coalition was falling apart. Now, of course, that's all on hold for the duration.

Convenient timing for what otherwise is the greatest intelligence failure since Pearl Harbor. Literally. That is not a figure of speech or exaggeration.

Netanyahu may, repeat, MAY, have jumped at the chance to save his career and his legacy. The attack literally saved his career. He put in a war cabinet and suspended the normal parliament, which I believe they call the Knesset. This is all conjecture at best, but it's logical conjecture. Unpopular leader facing crisis reboots the situation and uses the resulting war to take dictatorial power. That's a good elevator pitch in anybody's script department.

This is all conjecture, of course, but given what's currently happening in Israel and the disaspora, it's fairly logical conjecture. The historical facts in 30 years might cause the conclusion that it's not Israel's war. It's Netanyahu's war. He went in with the world's support. Those KIDNAPPED posters were being printed out and stuck on half the lamp posts in every city.

Now even POTUS is telling him to knock it off.

----

Whatever happened to LIHOP? Let It Happen On Purpose. It was never fully credible regarding 9/11, which started the previous war in the Middle East, but it's unsettlingly credible now. Did he have intell that something was up and choose to suppress it because there was a chance to save his ass? I don't know. That's the kind of thing they'll discuss in 20 years.

I don't have a clear answer. Like 9/11, it's all speculation. The facts on the ground are still that Israel was attacked, and it went in with the world's support, but when even Biden is saying enough, it has obviously lost it. Today BiBi is all over the Nooz in our faces telling us all to shut up, he's going to keep wiping out civilians and critical protected infrastructure in violation of international law, using the cover story that he's rooting out terrorists.

THAT, at least, is a fact.
Or it may be a simple as these two groups of people simply do not get along and haven’t gotten along for many, many years. Hamas has stated they want to destroy the State of Israel. Anyone doubt their intentions? I don’t. Anyone doubt those facts? I don’t. Anyone doubt the events of Oct 7? I don’t.

I get people want this all to end. But what does that look like? I dunno. But if I was Israeli, I’m not sure I would quit before the job was done. Hamas isn’t going to change its colors.
User avatar
ZoWie
Posts: 5108
Joined: Sun Oct 24, 2021 4:39 pm
Location: The blue parts of the map

Re: Hamas fires 7000 rockets at Israel, starting major war

Post by ZoWie »

Hamas wants to destroy Israel. That is given.

I don't know the level of support, as opposed to grudging acceptance of reality, that Hamas had in Gaza pre-war. It was really the only thing in there that passed for authority, but I don't know about the hearts and minds.

I know now.

It would have worked had every man, woman, and child in Gaza been a Hamas paramilitary in training, but that's ludicrous in the real world outside wartime hysteria.

Netanyahu, who was likely as interested in saving his own ass as avenging a terrorist attack, handed Hamas the moral high ground. He declared early on that anything walking upright in designated parts of Gaza was fair game. Then the designated parts expanded to fill the whole territory.

THAT is an amazing achievement. They are out-terrorizing the terrorists. For better or worse, a lot of political power really does grow out of the barrel of a TV camera lens (to update Mao), and BiBi has lost that part of the war, big time.

The strategy here borders on insanity. You don't beat Hamas by acting exactly like the kind of people that they want the world to think you are. You don't create a situation for the world to interpret as no good guys. You want the moral high ground. Israel had it, going in. Now? Well, just read the spin doctoring in the Nooz. Not going well.

That's really all you're going to get out of me. Somebody needs to stay objective. I realize that in wartime that is the most subversive act of them all.
Last edited by ZoWie on Wed Dec 27, 2023 11:19 am, edited 3 times in total.
"We must remember that we cannot abandon the truth and remain a free nation." --Liz Cheney, Republican, 7/21/22
Post Reply