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California is now officially over the edge
http://radiofreeliberal.com/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=23348
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Author:  ZoWie [ Wed Jun 13, 2018 12:01 pm ]
Post subject:  California is now officially over the edge

We've finally made it to the absurd phase of the initiative process, which has been broken for years. No one did anything about it, as usual, and now we're officially certifiable. Loony land. Dropped off the edge and didn't even need an earthquake.

http://www.latimes.com/politics/la-pol- ... story.html

Quote:
Radical plan to split California into three states earns spot on November ballot


California’s 168-year run as a single entity, hugging the continent’s edge for hundreds of miles and sprawling east across mountains and desert, could come to an end next year — as a controversial plan to split the Golden State into three new jurisdictions qualified Tuesday for the Nov. 6 ballot.

If a majority of voters who cast ballots agree, a long and contentious process would begin for three separate states to take the place of California, with one primarily centered around Los Angeles and the other two divvying up the counties to the north and south. Completion of the radical plan — far from certain, given its many hurdles at judicial, state and federal levels — would make history.

It would be the first division of an existing U.S. state since the creation of West Virginia in 1863.

Author:  ZoWie [ Wed Jun 13, 2018 12:26 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: California is now officially over the edge

1. Kiss the UC goodbye. Parents in the Bay Area are going to love paying out of state tuition if the kids are accepted to whatever happens to UCLA and not whatever happens to UC Berkeley. And vice versa.

2. Figuring out taxes will capture souls.

3. It gives the Republican Party its Final Solution to the California Problem.

there are more...........

Author:  Libertas [ Wed Jun 13, 2018 12:33 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: California is now officially over the edge

Californians were dumb enough to vote for open primaries which can NEVER help the D party so dont assume this bullshit wont get votes.

Putin is behind this of course.

Author:  Number6 [ Wed Jun 13, 2018 12:43 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: California is now officially over the edge

We've finally made it to the absurd phase of the initiative process, which has been broken for years. No one did anything about it, as usual, and now we're officially certifiable. Loony land. Dropped off the edge and didn't even need an earthquake.

http://www.latimes.com/politics/la-pol- ... story.html


It has about as much of a chance of passing as an atheist has being elected Pope.

Author:  glenfs [ Wed Jun 13, 2018 12:48 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: California is now officially over the edge

Can you imagine the fight over the unfunded liabilities and which state would take on what amount.

Author:  adam32492 [ Wed Jun 13, 2018 12:48 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: California is now officially over the edge

It's not going to pass but imagine California producing six Democratic Senators?

Author:  ZoWie [ Wed Jun 13, 2018 12:51 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: California is now officially over the edge

I know, which is another reason the initiative process is INSANE. Any dolt with a few megabucks in funding can qualify anything. Why not just raise the pathetically low number of valid signatures required so that it keeps up with the times?

Glen's tax thing is valid. Can you imagine the legal mess?

The 6 senator thing sounds sexy but 2 of them would undoubtedly be Republicans. And the GOP would also get the CA electoral vote broken up, which is practically existential for them.

Author:  Number6 [ Wed Jun 13, 2018 12:59 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: California is now officially over the edge

1. Kiss the UC goodbye. Parents in the Bay Area are going to love paying out of state tuition if the kids are accepted to whatever happens to UCLA and not whatever happens to UC Berkeley. And vice versa.

2. Figuring out taxes will capture souls.

3. It gives the Republican Party its Final Solution to the California Problem.

there are more...........

Where would the state income tax be paid to for the year before the official breakup if the state were be broken into three new states? I live next to San Diego Southern California under the plan, so would my taxes go to Sacramento which would be in Northern California or to Southern California?

Seriously, this is a solution looking for a problem. Like all states, California has problems but breaking it up into three states isn't the solution. The only "state" of the three proposed that could afford to operate as a state would be "California," Los Angles county to Monterey county, since that would be the state with the largest tax basis based on population and businesses. The other two "states" would become California's poorer relations with a smaller tax base. By keeping California as one state we can leverage economies of scale to tackle problems like infrastructure, education, pollution, etc...

IMO, the real reason behind this measure is to give republicans the chance of picking up four new Senators as a handful of House seats.

Author:  marindem [ Wed Jun 13, 2018 1:50 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: California is now officially over the edge

It will not happen.

Author:  Ike Bana [ Wed Jun 13, 2018 3:34 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: California is now officially over the edge

It's not going to pass but imagine California producing six Democratic Senators?


There's something that will never happen, six Democratic senators. The way they would split up the state would be to make sure that at least one and possibly two of the three new states would end up red. And it would be the last time that LA and San Francisco would be generating 55 California electoral votes for a Democratic candidate for president.

Author:  bird [ Wed Jun 13, 2018 3:48 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: California is now officially over the edge

The dangers of legal weed. ;)

Author:  Motor City [ Wed Jun 13, 2018 4:06 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: California is now officially over the edge

what they said about trump and brexit

Author:  ZoWie [ Wed Jun 13, 2018 4:44 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: California is now officially over the edge

Well, calexit went away when everyone found out it was another Russian psyop to divide people and weaken the country.

That's what this would do too, but I don't know the sponsor's motives well enough to say for sure that he's an agent. He seems to be some kind of digital-disruption entrepreneur. He spent millions trying to get the last one (6 states) qualified, and it didn't. He spent millions more, and this one did. The L.A. Times writer said he paid much more per signature than most people do. He's dropping big bucks, over and over, for this thing. Where's he getting them?

Author:  rainwater [ Wed Jun 13, 2018 4:55 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: California is now officially over the edge

:rw) :rw) :rw)
Quote:
...with one primarily centered around Los Angeles and the other two divvying up the counties to the north and south..


ok then, that screams of Escape From LA...fencing in LA since its, such a, ya know, PIA.

so who gets SaltonSea area? maybe you can fence in the CO Rio. :rw) :rw)
who gets Humboldt? you get humboldt then you get the new burns now deserts of NCA too.
who gets the sierras? you get them you get the burn areas the dead areas too.

this is so stupid. :rw) :rw) :rw) :rw)

Author:  ProfessorX [ Wed Jun 13, 2018 5:19 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: California is now officially over the edge

That's what this would do too, but I don't know the sponsor's motives well enough to say for sure that he's an agent. He seems to be some kind of digital-disruption entrepreneur. He spent millions trying to get the last one (6 states) qualified, and it didn't. He spent millions more, and this one did. The L.A. Times writer said he paid much more per signature than most people do. He's dropping big bucks, over and over, for this thing. Where's he getting them?


It's pretty clear the objective here is to get more California/Calsep1-2-3 Republicans in Congress.

I think I know who would fund that.

BTW, current polling on this initiative, according to Ballotopedia:
4/19 SurveyUSA -17% in favor, 72% opposed, 10% undecided.

Author:  Ely [ Wed Jun 13, 2018 7:13 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: California is now officially over the edge

The dangers of legal weed. ;)


LOL
Good one

Author:  rainwater [ Wed Jun 13, 2018 7:59 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: California is now officially over the edge

ahhh, the map makes it clear what this is about.

theyre using the anger of the public, once again, to get their way.
NCA, SFBay and Humboldt, what is left of "trees" would have its own control over clear cutting all the remaining trees.
SCA, central farm and desert, would then have TOTAL control over the imperial valley and ANY water coming
in from the ColoradoRio to the vast farmlands with senior water rights to CO RIO WATER.
the food production.

then, there would be that bastion of jews and "liberals" (along with the abundance of goppers who live there
part time)..there would then be LA to SantaBarbara left to their own devices.
they have NO resources left so, um, fuck'em.

this isnt the people, this is the trolls who work for the capitalist pigs who want all remaining resources
in this contry.
NE/Colorado wanted to secede..'cept they didnt have the population the fire depts the medical, schools
buses water roads blah blah.
they did have the massive nat gas fields....

if this was about the popular vote, the people?....they'd just divide the state in two.
this is about wallst, corps, the remaining resources left over. dont fool yourselves otherwise.

Author:  glenfs [ Wed Jun 13, 2018 8:34 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: California is now officially over the edge


It's pretty clear the objective here is to get more California/Calsep1-2-3 Republicans in Congress.

I think I know who would fund that.

BTW, current polling on this initiative, according to Ballotopedia:
4/19 SurveyUSA -17% in favor, 72% opposed, 10% undecided.



Things like this and ballot initiative's in general are an example of what we would have if we had public financed elections. Every screwball and morning DJ would figure out a way to get their name on the ballot. Not unlike what happen after Gray Davis when Arnold was elected Governor in the special election.

The thought of voting to divide California is a waste of time, money and effort. Was probably done more to get the guy who spearheaded it some publicity.

Author:  Number6 [ Wed Jun 13, 2018 9:36 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: California is now officially over the edge



Things like this and ballot initiative's in general are an example of what we would have if we had public financed elections. Every screwball and morning DJ would figure out a way to get their name on the ballot. Not unlike what happen after Gray Davis when Arnold was elected Governor in the special election.

The current method of getting your name on a ballot or an issue on the ballot is to pickup and complete the election form(s), pay the filing fee, get the required minimum number of signatures, and turn-in the signatures to the Registrar of Voters or Secretary of State. On many ballot measures, the signature gathers are paid to collect signatures. We don't have public financing of elections in California so why would this be any different if there were for a candidate or issue to get on the ballot? Clearly, you haven't thought this through.

Quote:
The thought of voting to divide California is a waste of time, money and effort. Was probably done more to get the guy who spearheaded it some publicity.

Tim Draper, who is funding this, apparently has the time and the money to push this. As I said before, "It has about as much of a chance of passing as an atheist has being elected Pope. "

Author:  glenfs [ Wed Jun 13, 2018 9:48 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: California is now officially over the edge

The current method of getting your name on a ballot or an issue on the ballot is to pickup and complete the election form(s), pay the filing fee, get the required minimum number of signatures, and turn-in the signatures to the Registrar of Voters or Secretary of State. On many ballot measures, the signature gathers are paid to collect signatures. We don't have public financing of elections in California so why would this be any different if there were for a candidate or issue to get on the ballot? Clearly, you haven't thought this through.


Tim Draper, who is funding this, apparently has the time and the money to push this. As I said before, "It has about as much of a chance of passing as an atheist has being elected Pope. "



Because getting your name on the ballot with no funding is worthless. If Jill Stein was to get on the DNC ballot and we had public funding she would have to get the same funds as every other DNC candidate. Take that times 15 Jill Steins or some GOP screwball. It would be a cluster mess, to use your military terms.

Author:  glenfs [ Wed Jun 13, 2018 9:50 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: California is now officially over the edge

The current method of getting your name on a ballot or an issue on the ballot is to pickup and complete the election form(s), pay the filing fee, get the required minimum number of signatures, and turn-in the signatures to the Registrar of Voters or Secretary of State. On many ballot measures, the signature gathers are paid to collect signatures. We don't have public financing of elections in California so why would this be any different if there were for a candidate or issue to get on the ballot? Clearly, you haven't thought this through.


Tim Draper, who is funding this, apparently has the time and the money to push this. As I said before, "It has about as much of a chance of passing as an atheist has being elected Pope. "



I am pretty sure we have had atheist popes. I am thinking of the Borgias and maybe some others.

Author:  Sam Lefthand [ Wed Jun 13, 2018 11:59 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: California is now officially over the edge

It's not going to pass but imagine California producing six Democratic Senators?


:|

If we're going to do something radical let's fix the apportionment. Let's make every county in the state into a state, and even doing that will still leave us somewhat behind Wyoming apportionment wise because we only have 58 counties.

I crunched some population numbers. If we were to reduce Wyoming to only having one Senator, California would need 66 senators to make the apportionment even.

Here's the math, Wyoming has a population of about 0.6 million, California has a population of 39.5 million. 39.5 divided by 0.6 equals 66.

Author:  Motor City [ Thu Jun 14, 2018 7:12 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: California is now officially over the edge

could find that the closer it gets to the election the more people are drawn to make the most illogical choice some sort of strange irresistible magnetism of self destruction just because they can and its easy.

Author:  glenfs [ Thu Jun 14, 2018 8:26 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: California is now officially over the edge

could find that the closer it gets to the election the more people are drawn to make the most illogical choice some sort of strange irresistible magnetism of self destruction just because they can and its easy.


I have to admit I don't care if it is California or a RW state, I love it when screwy things like this happen. It makes me laugh, knowing all along it could never happen even if it were to pass. But, there all those who not only support it but, believe it the same way my granddad believed the bible was hand written by God.

Both being wrong but, no way to convince them.

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