Congress Hearing on FTX Crypto Collapse

[ZoWie]

If it wasn't an attempt to avoid government scrutiny over transactions and cash flow, why did they call it "crypto" in the first place? The root means cover up, and the derivation comes from cryptography, the practice of hiding important information in coded gibberish or excess bandwidth in less sensitive information.

The people behind it sold it as convenience, but there was always the inference that it would be the perfect way to hide cash transactions. It's great for ransom demands, but as an investment it has its issues. I don't envy the people who now have to figure out how to control the latest Internet monster.

I also don't have to take it seriously as an investment. There's no documentation. Your money is worth what some deliberately obfuscated string of machines says it is. If the data vanishes, so does your money.

It's not even a betting casino. Those have cashiers.

[gounion]

No need. I know the answer.

You don't know shit. All you know is to blame the Dems for everything. You're an idiot. You can't even make a link on a message board. That takes a special kind of stupid.

[JoeMemphis]

You don't know shit. All you know is to blame the Dems for everything. You're an idiot. You can't even make a link on a message board. That takes a special kind of stupid.

[gounion]

Yeah, you got nothin'.

[JoeMemphis]

Yeah, you got nothin'.

You never do.

[gounion]

You never do.

You haven't made it case. It also turns out today that the company gave equally to Republicans too. I'd give a link but you are to stupid to figure out how they work.

You can lay all the financial scams, disasters and meltdowns at the feet of Ronald Reagan.

[JoeMemphis]

You haven't made it case. It also turns out today that the company gave equally to Republicans too. I'd give a link but you are to stupid to figure out how they work.

You can lay all the financial scams, disasters and meltdowns at the feet of Ronald Reagan.

So you got nothing current. You can't explain how a regulatory agency has jurisdiction in a case you claim isn't regulated. You can't identify where lack of regulation played a role. You just repeat a vague talking point and you go all the way back to a President that left office before the internet in order to blame Republicans. And I didn't blame democrats. I said it was a regulatory failure. Other posters turned this into a political blame game. Who is supposed to protect the public against this type of investment fraud? Isn't that supposed to be the government? That is their job. Do you think they did a good job in this case?

[ZoWie]

No, the government did a lousy job, and continues to do so.

I'm not even sure the government has the desire, let alone the mandate, to do something about crypto. Funny, people won't wear face masks in crowded indoor spaces with poor ventilation to help stop the spread of the worst pandemic in 100 years, but they will gladly fall for such scams as cryptocurrency without the slightest investigation. Crypto is the high-tech 21st century version of the Tulip Mania and South Sea Bubble. You give total strangers good money backed by the full faith and credit of the United States of America, and in return you get an entry in someone else's hidden database saying you have x number of widgets. Or you buy your very own file with a pretty picture in it, and wait for it to be worth more than the Mona Lisa.

Say, have you heard that Manhattan is out of balance? I mean, look at it. It has all these huge buildings at one end, and miles of parks and 4-story walkups at the other. Help me raise 100 billion dollars and I'll stick a 2x4 in the soil on the Lower East Side and jump and down on it until I consider Manhattan to be in balance again.

https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/i-saw-new-york/

[gounion]

So you got nothing current. You can't explain how a regulatory agency has jurisdiction in a case you claim isn't regulated. You can't identify where lack of regulation played a role. You just repeat a vague talking point and you go all the way back to a President that left office before the internet in order to blame Republicans. And I didn't blame democrats. I said it was a regulatory failure. Other posters turned this into a political blame game. Who is supposed to protect the public against this type of investment fraud? Isn't that supposed to be the government? That is their job. Do you think they did a good job in this case?

I have the history.

After FDR's New Deal and regulation of the banks and financial system, we never had any meltdowns of our banks and markets.

Then Reagan came in and tore down FDR's regulations, and we've had nothing but a steady stream of meltdowns.

It's what you want. You just want to blame it on Democrats, all while you complain about regulations.

[Glennfs]

I have the history.

After FDR's New Deal and regulation of the banks and financial system, we never had any meltdowns of our banks and markets.

Then Reagan came in and tore down FDR's regulations, and we've had nothing but a steady stream of meltdowns.

It's what you want. You just want to blame it on Democrats, all while you complain about regulations.

The problem is you on the left do not realize there is such a thing as over regulation.

[ZoWie]

Oh don't worry, I can think of plenty of examples of over-regulation. They are all around.

Now, somehow I don't think greed and duplicity have ever been over-regulated, however. No, you're thinking of what consenting adults do in bed with nobody watching. Some people really see a need to regulate that.

[gounion]

The problem is you on the left do not realize there is such a thing as over regulation.

Thank you for making my point. This is exactly what you would say if the Dems wanted to regulate Crypto.

[Glennfs]

Thank you for making my point. This is exactly what you would say if the Dems wanted to regulate Crypto.

No as you know I am now and have always been opposed to Crypto. My point is and was that you have never considered any regulation to go to far. Because you do not believe there is such a thing as to many regulations

[gounion]

No as you know I am now and have always been opposed to Crypto. My point is and was that you have never considered any regulation to go to far. Because you do not believe there is such a thing as to many regulations

Sure there are regulations that go to far. But your God Ronnie gave use unending financial meltdowns when he did away with all of FDR's regulations.

Tell me - would you put money in the bank if your deposits weren't insured by the government?

[Glennfs]

Sure there are regulations that go to far. But your God Ronnie gave use unending financial meltdowns when he did away with all of FDR's regulations.

Tell me - would you put money in the bank if your deposits weren't insured by the government?

Yes I would and as far as Reagan goes we have had democratic administrations who could have reversed anything he was able to pass.
According to you Carter was a much better president

[gounion]

Yes I would and as far as Reagan goes we have had democratic administrations who could have reversed anything he was able to pass.
According to you Carter was a much better president

Reagan was quite a low bar.

Again, you got your way with Reagan, and we're now paying the price.

[JoeMemphis]

I have the history.

After FDR's New Deal and regulation of the banks and financial system, we never had any meltdowns of our banks and markets.

Then Reagan came in and tore down FDR's regulations, and we've had nothing but a steady stream of meltdowns.

It's what you want. You just want to blame it on Democrats, all while you complain about regulations.

Look that’s a wonderful talking point that has nothing to do with FTX. To begin, there are a shitload of regulations over reporting. Reagan didn’t throw them all out despite what you’ve been fed. So you tell me, what regulation did Reagan get rid of that would have applied in this case?

Companies that report to the SEC are subject to audit. They are regulated. That is why the SEC is involved. They have jurisdiction in this matter because FTX falls under their regulatory authority. Do you want to dispute that?

So the question becomes, how did a company that collected billions of dollars from investors get past SEC regulators and get past audit? What broke down in our system that allowed that to happen. It’s 2022 and Reagan and FDR have been dead and buried for decades.

[gounion]

Look that’s a wonderful talking point that has nothing to do with FTX. To begin, there are a shitload of regulations over reporting. Reagan didn’t throw them all out despite what you’ve been fed. So you tell me, what regulation did Reagan get rid of that would have applied in this case?

Companies that report to the SEC are subject to audit. They are regulated. That is why the SEC is involved. They have jurisdiction in this matter because FTX falls under their regulatory authority. Do you want to dispute that?

So the question becomes, how did a company that collected billions of dollars from investors get past SEC regulators and get past audit? What broke down in our system that allowed that to happen. It’s 2022 and Reagan and FDR have been dead and buried for decades.

As always you are wrong, Joe. The SEC charged FTX leaders with defrauding investors. That's what they are charged with. Not audits.

And the company is based in the Bahamas.

[ZoWie]

And was based in China before that.

[gounion]

And was based in China before that.

It's hard to see how the SEC has any power over a company NOT based in the USA. Yes, they can charge them with fraud for what they do here, but that's pretty much all.

But all Joe wants to do is just blame the Biden Administration.

As ignorant as Joe is, it's hard to believe he has a degree in accounting.

[JoeMemphis]

As always you are wrong, Joe. The SEC charged FTX leaders with defrauding investors. That's what they are charged with. Not audits.

And the company is based in the Bahamas.

Audit is a tool you use to prevent or detect fraud. It’s not a charge. The SEC is a regulatory agency. They have regulatory authority. If you commit financial crimes outside their jurisdiction then you get charged by the IRS, Secret Service, FBI. The SEC charges people they regulate.

So since you claim this was a crime committed outside of regulation due to something a dead man did 30 years ago, maybe you can explain why the SEC is involved at all. Or is this another question you will continue to avoid answering.

[gounion]

Audit is a tool you use to prevent or detect fraud. It’s not a charge. The SEC is a regulatory agency. They have regulatory authority. If you commit financial crimes outside their jurisdiction then you get charged by the IRS, Secret Service, FBI. The SEC charges people they regulate.

So since you claim this was a crime committed outside of regulation due to something a dead man did 30 years ago, maybe you can explain why the SEC is involved at all. Or is this another question you will continue to avoid answering.

Look, you're just making shit up. They are charged with crimes. Fraud is a crime. They didn't break a regulation, they broke a law. I understand you don't understand the difference.

[gounion]

Look, you're just making shit up. They are charged with crimes. Fraud is a crime. They didn't break a regulation, they broke a law. I understand you don't understand the difference.

Show me their audit that they failed. Go ahead.

[JoeMemphis]

Look, you're just making shit up. They are charged with crimes. Fraud is a crime. They didn't break a regulation, they broke a law. I understand you don't understand the difference.

Not making anything up. It’s simple. If you are regulated by the SEC, they charge you. If you are not regulated by the SEC, someone else charges you. You are outside the jurisdiction of the SEC. The SEC is a regulatory agency. You are claiming there were no regulatory violations. How then is the SEC involved?

If you owned an apartment building and that building was protected by a fire alarm system that included sprinklers and someone set that building on fire and injured many tenants. Let’s say the fire alarm system didn’t work. You would blame the arsonist but you would also blame the faulty fire alarm system. The system that was supposed to protect your tenants. You act as if you wouldn’t question the failure of the system put in place to protect your tenants.

The SEC is there to regulate the investment community and to protect investors. Obviously it didn’t work in the case of FTX and instead of acknowledging the failure and asking why, you are running around telling people to look the other way.

[gounion]

Not making anything up. It’s simple. If you are regulated by the SEC, they charge you. If you are not regulated by the SEC, someone else charges you. You are outside the jurisdiction of the SEC. The SEC is a regulatory agency. You are claiming there were no regulatory violations. How then is the SEC involved?

If you owned an apartment building and that building was protected by a fire alarm system that included sprinklers and someone set that building on fire and injured many tenants. Let’s say the fire alarm system didn’t work. You would blame the arsonist but you would also blame the faulty fire alarm system. The system that was supposed to protect your tenants. You act as if you wouldn’t question the failure of the system put in place to protect your tenants.

The SEC is there to regulate the investment community and to protect investors. Obviously it didn’t work in the case of FTX and instead of acknowledging the failure and asking why, you are running around telling people to look the other way.

They are protecting by charging people for financial crimes.

But go ahead, show me the audits. Or shut the fuck up.