DeSantis vows death to leftists

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gounion
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Re: DeSantis vows death to leftists

Post by gounion »

JoeMemphis wrote: Thu Jun 01, 2023 9:56 am Destroy? Define “destroy”. Do you mean literally or figuratively? Are we talking ideals or are we talking actual life and liberty? You don’t know. You can’t say.

Most sane rational people know that no one is calling for actual death or imprisonment. For one thing, it’s clearly illegal and unconstitutional. However, we can’t control how weak minded individuals who live mentally in a fantasy world might interpret such statements. Idiots such as yourself might take something said literally. It doesn’t take much to “trigger” you.

Again, no one is concerned about you or your politics outside this small little group. Nobody is coming for you. No need for all this paranoia. Take a pill. Take a nap.
Why don't you look at the quote. Why is it you think it's fine for a candidate to make death threats? Why do you support this hateful rhetoric? I mean, it's not enough he goes after minorities, gays and trans people, now he threatens to destroy half the nation, and you're just fine. You'll happily vote for him.

And is my ideals going to be illegal? That's what he's promising. Again, I've never tried to take YOUR freedom of though away from you. Why do you accept to when it's the other side? I'd stand and fight against someone on OUR side who says they'll destroy conservatism in this country. That's because I believe in what our nation stands for.
JoeMemphis

Re: DeSantis vows death to leftists

Post by JoeMemphis »

gounion wrote: Thu Jun 01, 2023 10:03 am Why don't you look at the quote. Why is it you think it's fine for a candidate to make death threats? Why do you support this hateful rhetoric? I mean, it's not enough he goes after minorities, gays and trans people, now he threatens to destroy half the nation, and you're just fine. You'll happily vote for him.

And is my ideals going to be illegal? That's what he's promising. Again, I've never tried to take YOUR freedom of though away from you. Why do you accept to when it's the other side? I'd stand and fight against someone on OUR side who says they'll destroy conservatism in this country. That's because I believe in what our nation stands for.
I have already said I don’t support hateful rhetoric from anyone. Not Ron. Not Don. Not Chuck. Not Maxine. Etc, etc, etc. No one. For the uninformed and ignorant, that means everyone. It’s plain English so if we are extremely lucky, you may understand. Expectations are low.

Nobody gives a shit about your ideals or your thoughts. Think what you want. Nobody is coming for you. I know you fancy yourself as some kind of martyr for liberalism on this message board but outside of this little group nobody gives a shit. So you can put down your cape. Sir back. Recline. Watch your favorite show. Take a nap. It will all be alright.

Edited to add: Your claim as to defending the rights and freedoms of other individuals to think and choose for themselves was put to the test numerous times during the pandemic. What you so often demonstrated was a willingness to ignore other peoples rights to decide for themselves and instead willingly on repeated occassions supported the governments ability to force its views on others. The test is whether you stand for those liberties when it’s hard and repeatedly, you failed. Repeatedly. So while you like to sell this notion that you are somehow a champion of civil liberties you are on the record as someone who will cave quite easily when it suits you. Color me unimpressed Captain Courageous. You aint no martyr. You ain’t no hero.
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ZoWie
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Re: DeSantis vows death to leftists

Post by ZoWie »

There is no basic human right to ignore sensible safety precautions during a 100-year-level pandemic. If you want to take a chance with your own health, well, that's your business. The problem does not occur until people enter crowded spaces. In such a case, your right to spew germs ends at the other person's respiratory system. The government has the power to protect the majority from the brain-dead minority who think everything is some kind of a plot.

The situation is akin to debating whether it's legal to give tangible aid to an enemy military during a declared war. Nobody questions that.

Maybe we need formal war declarations for pandemics exceeding a certain explicitly defined threshold, so we don't get this same BS every time.
"We must remember that we cannot abandon the truth and remain a free nation." --Liz Cheney, Republican, 7/21/22
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Toonces
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Re: DeSantis vows death to leftists

Post by Toonces »

We routinely create laws that protect others. As was the purpose of what occurred during the pandemic. Vaccines, for instance, are to protect you *AND* others. As was any mask mandate. It wasn't intended to restrict anyone's liberty but rather to protect the population at large. This was done based on scientific data and experts best interpreting and designing what may best serve all.

Laws that require compliance with the individual for the health, safety, and well-being of others are not new nor rare. I mean, you can't go around masturbating in public because that certainly would violate the well-being of others and their health. We don't consider this an undue imposition on one's personal freedoms (well, most of us). Many places still restrict women from going topless despite it not infringing on the healthy, safety, or well-being of others, and it does infringe on one's personal rights. So, yeah. we do things to protect others, to protect the majority.

Those laws are generally applied to what people do or have done, not who they are.
JoeMemphis

Re: DeSantis vows death to leftists

Post by JoeMemphis »

ZoWie wrote: Thu Jun 01, 2023 11:46 am There is no basic human right to ignore sensible safety precautions during a 100-year-level pandemic. If you want to take a chance with your own health, well, that's your business. The problem does not occur until people enter crowded spaces. In such a case, your right to spew germs ends at the other person's respiratory system. The government has the power to protect the majority from the brain-dead minority who think everything is some kind of a plot.

The situation is akin to debating whether it's legal to give tangible aid to an enemy military during a declared war. Nobody questions that.

Maybe we need formal war declarations for pandemics exceeding a certain explicitly defined threshold, so we don't get this same BS every time.
It all depends on what you mean by “sensible” and who gets to decide that and what data backs that up and how long these “sensible” measures last. Does the government have a right to do whatever it pleases as long as it unilaterally declares an emergency for two years? At what point in time do we ask the legislature to weigh in. Seems to me we don’t just ignore civil liberties indefinitely just because the government says it’s for our own good. I’m thinking civil liberties means that “we the people” get to make that determination for ourselves. The initial communication went from two weeks to stop the spread to keeping some schools closed in excess of a year.
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ZoWie
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Re: DeSantis vows death to leftists

Post by ZoWie »

Agreed that the "emergency" measures suffered from a certain fatigue factor. It could have been handled better. There is plenty of blame to go around on all sides.

The fact remains that the human psyche reacts badly to bad news, and the exact same thing happened in 1918. In both cases, policy seemed to be based on a false hope for a single outbreak followed by herd immunity and a spontaneous resolution of the crisis. Unfortunately, the big virus pandemics rarely follow such a course. They are more like a prolonged war, which is typically handled with "for the duration" rhetoric involving blood, sweat, toil, and tears.

I would hope that it's handled better on all levels next time, but with memory being short and the time periods between these (so far) being long, I probably hope in vain.
"We must remember that we cannot abandon the truth and remain a free nation." --Liz Cheney, Republican, 7/21/22
JoeMemphis

Re: DeSantis vows death to leftists

Post by JoeMemphis »

ZoWie wrote: Thu Jun 01, 2023 1:31 pm Agreed that the "emergency" measures suffered from a certain fatigue factor. It could have been handled better. There is plenty of blame to go around on all sides.

The fact remains that the human psyche reacts badly to bad news, and the exact same thing happened in 1918. In both cases, policy seemed to be based on a false hope for a single outbreak followed by herd immunity and a spontaneous resolution of the crisis. Unfortunately, the big virus pandemics rarely follow such a course. They are more like a prolonged war, which is typically handled with "for the duration" rhetoric involving blood, sweat, toil, and tears.

I would hope that it's handled better on all levels next time, but with memory being short and the time periods between these (so far) being long, I probably hope in vain.
I would agree that it could have been handled better. That goes without saying.
gounion
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Re: DeSantis vows death to leftists

Post by gounion »

JoeMemphis wrote: Thu Jun 01, 2023 1:17 pm It all depends on what you mean by “sensible” and who gets to decide that and what data backs that up and how long these “sensible” measures last. Does the government have a right to do whatever it pleases as long as it unilaterally declares an emergency for two years? At what point in time do we ask the legislature to weigh in. Seems to me we don’t just ignore civil liberties indefinitely just because the government says it’s for our own good. I’m thinking civil liberties means that “we the people” get to make that determination for ourselves. The initial communication went from two weeks to stop the spread to keeping some schools closed in excess of a year.
"Sensible" is a word that isn't in your vocabulary. You have proven you have no sense at all.
Glennfs
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Re: DeSantis vows death to leftists

Post by Glennfs »

gounion wrote: Thu Jun 08, 2023 2:44 pm "Sensible" is a word that isn't in your vocabulary. You have proven you have no sense at all.
Looking for another flame war I see
" I am a socialist " Bernie Sanders
gounion
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Re: DeSantis vows death to leftists

Post by gounion »

Glennfs wrote: Thu Jun 08, 2023 3:13 pm Looking for another flame war I see
Just dealing in reality. Joe doesn't care if tens of millions died, he thinks he shouldn't ever have to wear a mask. Good thing he's not a surgeon, eh?
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