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PostPosted: Tue Nov 20, 2012 12:40 am 
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Hey glenn, let me put it to you in terms you would understand.
You have an over-weight trailer that has to go to Fargo Nd. and the tires are pretty worn, some are showing gouges in the sides, and your tractor tires aren't that much better. You know it's going to be an overnighter but in this weather, it's not going to be the greatest knowing that the heater core in the cab sprang a leak in the summer so it was your quick fix to just by-pass it back then, but now it's going to be a very cold drive. The starter has been acting up lately as well, having to jump out of the cab to start it by smacking it with a hammer a few times to turn over.... etc. You give it an old college try to get the delivery done and get back to turn it in the garage to get the fixes needed for the next run... only to find out you have to make yet another trip to Montana.

That's what these bakeries have turned to under this management. The infrastructure has been eroded, some of the newer equipment had failed and was shut down and moved out of the way for the aged old back-ups to run to get the job done. Ovens shutting down prematurely, and the workforce swears the equipment was sabotaged but they can't prove it other than they could show that it has been malfunctioning, and no service tech. staff to make the repairs... many were laid off a while ago.

The Boss's got their raises, but the working staff were told they were going to have to pay more for their health care, lose vacation time (which they use for sick time as well) and they were going to get a serious reduction of pay to boot.

The straw that broke the camel's back.

Your trolling attitude really stinks all through this thread, and it shows how much of a loser you really are.


EXACTLY AS JOHN NICHOLS OF THE NATION REPORTED ON THE ED SCHULTZ RADIO SHOW TODAY!
It could not have been verbalized any better than that exchange, and I have yet to see what Ed does on his show... online. ugh.

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PostPosted: Tue Nov 20, 2012 12:44 am 
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No.

It's pretty easy to see what's happening. The threat to close down was a bluff, and the union called their bluff. Now the company has begged for mediation.

And, luckily, a smart company may be coming to bail the idiots who run Hostess out. You can bet this - while the workforce stays, the idiots who ran the company will be out of a job.

GoU

I sure than hell hope that the top get's the pink slip. If not... they owe the company a whole lot of money and get the axe to boot.
This is personal to me! There is blood involved and that's all I'll say about that.

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PostPosted: Tue Nov 20, 2012 12:45 am 
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Now we have mwingman saying that Bain Capital is a bunch of scoundrels, how good does that get?

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PostPosted: Tue Nov 20, 2012 12:48 am 
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Now we have mwingman saying that Bain Capital is a bunch of scoundrels, how good does that get?


That is not what I said.


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PostPosted: Tue Nov 20, 2012 12:51 am 
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Now we have mwingman saying that Bain Capital is a bunch of scoundrels, how good does that get?

It IS quite funny. But when anyone, even a rightie, says that a union is right, wingman must immediately attack them.

GoU


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PostPosted: Tue Nov 20, 2012 1:00 am 
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Ummm ... it was the bankruptcy judge that called for the mediation. Hostess had not talked to the baker's union since August.

The bankruptcy Judge ordered it, it was an unresolved issue that he had no jurisdiction, but had the sense to direct the company to try to resolve the issue with the workers since it was the company was the one who stopped the discussion. I am sure the judge is also ordering more information from the company in reference to the full pay charts to see where monies went.
That may come back to bite the top ten in the office of the company, and anyone on the board of directors.

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PostPosted: Tue Nov 20, 2012 1:07 am 
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Ya'll wanna hear something REALLY funny? A few posts ago, wingman said this:

What do you think they are going to do? Offer more money and benefits to the unions? Give them seats on the board? Sit down with them and ask them how they should run their business? :rw)

Well, guess what? The deal that the company negotiated, that the Teamsters accepted but the Bakers turned down, GAVE THE UNIONS TWO SEATS ON THE BOARD OF DIRECTORS!

GoU :rofl:


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PostPosted: Tue Nov 20, 2012 1:21 am 
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:rofl:
And they call unions thugs...

That's principles!

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PostPosted: Tue Nov 20, 2012 2:57 am 
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I hate to say it, but I suspect a buyout is not in the best interest of the workers. Usually, if the company is doing well and is bought out, many of the workers (if not all, like in a relocation) still lose their jobs. I don't know historically how often a company doing this poorly is bought out and not seriously affected by the new owners/management in terms of jobs lost and major changes they denied would happen before the buyout. I've seen it happen too many times. I would never trust a buyout. That's not to say it can't work in their favor...just that from my meager experience (of going through four major company closures and/or buyouts) it doesn't bode well.


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PostPosted: Tue Nov 20, 2012 8:49 am 
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It IS quite funny. But when anyone, even a rightie, says that a union is right, wingman must immediately attack them.

GoU


You don't get it. I'm not attacking Sun Capital. I'm laughing at you.


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PostPosted: Tue Nov 20, 2012 8:51 am 
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Ya'll wanna hear something REALLY funny? A few posts ago, wingman said this:

What do you think they are going to do? Offer more money and benefits to the unions? Give them seats on the board? Sit down with them and ask them how they should run their business? :rw)

Well, guess what? The deal that the company negotiated, that the Teamsters accepted but the Bakers turned down, GAVE THE UNIONS TWO SEATS ON THE BOARD OF DIRECTORS!

GoU :rofl:


So the Teamsters are part of the incompetent management team you were complaining about. Well I guess you burned me.

How many seats does the Baker union have?


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PostPosted: Tue Nov 20, 2012 8:53 am 
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Ya'll wanna hear something REALLY funny? A few posts ago, wingman said this:

What do you think they are going to do? Offer more money and benefits to the unions? Give them seats on the board? Sit down with them and ask them how they should run their business? :rw)

Well, guess what? The deal that the company negotiated, that the Teamsters accepted but the Bakers turned down, GAVE THE UNIONS TWO SEATS ON THE BOARD OF DIRECTORS!

GoU :rofl:

Don't argue with twinkles.


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PostPosted: Tue Nov 20, 2012 10:33 am 
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So the Teamsters are part of the incompetent management team you were complaining about. Well I guess you burned me.

How many seats does the Baker union have?

Obviously you are unable to read. The deal would be for seats on the board forward, starting now. They didn't have seats before.

The disaster that this company is can be laid at the feet of incompetent management.

GoU


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PostPosted: Tue Nov 20, 2012 11:07 am 
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PostPosted: Tue Nov 20, 2012 1:22 pm 
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According to GoUnion's link the proposal is:

The proposed new labor deal consists of:

1. An immediate 8% wage cut.
2. Work rules more favorable to the company.
3. Employer contributions for health insurance would decrease 17%.
4. Hostess contributions to multi-employer pension plans would cease until 2015, at which point the current required level of funding would plummet from $100 million to $25 million.

For their part, the unions would receive:

1. Two seats on a restructured nine-member board of directors.
2. 25% of equity (value TBD).

The unions are reallying buying into this "management incompotence" theory by agreeing to reduced labor costs and getting rid of stupid work rules.

Again, you got me.


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PostPosted: Tue Nov 20, 2012 1:37 pm 
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You guys are up on this. Liquidation is off, for now, and I suspect it was always a threat to get publicity. I'm glad the sorry history of this management is finally out there in the sunshine with the whole world looking. You can't completely excuse whoever negotiates for the bakers' union, but obviously the unions are at most 10% of the problem and management is the other 90%.

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PostPosted: Tue Nov 20, 2012 8:52 pm 
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PostPosted: Tue Nov 20, 2012 10:59 pm 
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Don't argue with twinkles.

And don't argue with the Grannie's that make the twinkies!

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PostPosted: Wed Nov 21, 2012 10:58 pm 
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i am often unsure because of the large time difference if breaking events are current, so please corerct if i am behind, but,

Hostess Judge Approves Wind-Down of Twinkie Maker

Final approval of the wind-down plan will be considered Nov. 29, and Hostess will seek court approval later for sales of major assets, such as its brands.
...

that appears to be that.

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PostPosted: Thu Nov 22, 2012 1:16 am 
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That was the last I read about it too. Liquidation is back on.


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PostPosted: Thu Nov 22, 2012 2:08 am 
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If it didn't involve the livelihoods of thousands of workers, I'd be apt to say, "Who cares? There's something highly suspicious about a product with a shelf-life of 120 years. Same goes for Wonder Bread, sorry America! I bought a loaf of Wonder Bread and after a month, it still hadn't staled. What's that about?"
The brand refused to enter the 21st century in more ways than one. I'm sure we haven't heard the last of this, but the whole bankruptcy deal was brought about by a failure to adjust and the easy out by going the way of the many companies acquired by vulture capitalists, all the while preserving the obscene paychecks of the "directors" and blaming the failure on workers who didn't want to give up their hard-earned packages.
And you wonder why we justifiably see class warfare in these decisions?
Sallie

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PostPosted: Thu Nov 22, 2012 1:55 pm 
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The vulture capitalists will Romney the pieces, selling them off as marketable brand names. Presumably the wretched products will continue, only with even more toxic ingredients, as made by non-union labor making even less in the way of wages, and with practically no real benefits whatsoever.

The only losers are the 18,500 workers, who are casualties of a classic scenario of mismanagement, self-aggrandizement, and then playing brinkmanship to bust the unions. The unions always lose these brinkmanship games, because if the company does go over into the void, the fat cats win anyway.

Remember that I was NOT an anti-capitalist until only a few years back, when it became clear what was going on, and that the stuff they say in elementary school about making better widgets was now folklore. I see no reason to believe it now either. The only thing they're interested in selling is companies, which are the new widgets. The old widgets are just there to get consumers interested in the company so it will pull a better price when the robber barons eat it.

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PostPosted: Thu Nov 22, 2012 8:56 pm 
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Just went to Hostess site and guess what the first info you find on the site is?

Quote:
Hostess Brands is closed.

We are sorry to announce that Hostess Brands, Inc. has been forced by a Bakers Union strike to shut down all operations and sell all company assets. For more information, go to hostessbrands.info. Thank you for all of your loyalty and support over the years.


No accountability there...no siree. It was the damned union workers' fault.


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PostPosted: Fri Nov 23, 2012 9:40 am 
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Just went to Hostess site and guess what the first info you find on the site is?



No accountability there...no siree. It was the damned union workers' fault.


Lets review, management told the Bakers Union if you go on strike we will be forced to close our doors. The Bakers Union went on strike anyway and management closed the doors. There is your accountability. At the very least they should have attempted to bargain while working. Even if they had been forced to take the 8% reduction in wages, that would have been better than an unemployment check. Plus they would have had a job and some income while searching for a new job.

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PostPosted: Fri Nov 23, 2012 9:45 am 
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The vulture capitalists will Romney the pieces, selling them off as marketable brand names. Presumably the wretched products will continue, only with even more toxic ingredients, as made by non-union labor making even less in the way of wages, and with practically no real benefits whatsoever.

The only losers are the 18,500 workers, who are casualties of a classic scenario of mismanagement, self-aggrandizement, and then playing brinkmanship to bust the unions. The unions always lose these brinkmanship games, because if the company does go over into the void, the fat cats win anyway.

Remember that I was NOT an anti-capitalist until only a few years back, when it became clear what was going on, and that the stuff they say in elementary school about making better widgets was now folklore. I see no reason to believe it now either. The only thing they're interested in selling is companies, which are the new widgets. The old widgets are just there to get consumers interested in the company so it will pull a better price when the robber barons eat it.


Your first two paragraphs are close to being spot on. Let me add those posters who said those workers will be able to find good Union jobs baking for the companies who buy up the brands are dreamers. First off unless the company who buys the brands are 100% Union they will bake the brands they buy in their non-union shops. Most of those 18,500 workers are totally screwed.

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