"My employees are largely responsible for any success..."

DIscuss all labor issues here.

Moderators: plunderer, Bernie the union guy

gounion
Board Emeritus
Posts: 36621
Joined: Wed May 04, 2011 11:26 pm

Re: "My employees are largely responsible for any success...

Post by gounion »

They built a new (unionized) Kroger right around the corner from my house. I love it. It's far superior in products and services to the (non-union) Albertsons that is nearby. The service and checkouts are also better, faster, friendlier and more professional than the non-union store. The prices are the same.

GoU

User avatar
Bernie the union guy
Site Admin
Posts: 3476
Joined: Mon Jun 06, 2011 10:48 pm
Location: The land of perpetual Lent! (aka Cincinnati)

Re: "My employees are largely responsible for any success...

Post by Bernie the union guy »

I hope they treat you like they treat me and the many in Western Hills of Cincinnati who go through "my doors"... LIKE FAMILY!
Bernie...
“The mountains are calling... and i must go." John Muir

Image

User avatar
plunderer
Site Admin
Posts: 2974
Joined: Sun May 01, 2011 7:20 pm
Location: Ragin' Cajun
Contact:

Re: "My employees are largely responsible for any success...

Post by plunderer »

gounion » Mon Nov 26, 2012 12:16 am wrote:They built a new (unionized) Kroger right around the corner from my house. I love it. It's far superior in products and services to the (non-union) Albertsons that is nearby. The service and checkouts are also better, faster, friendlier and more professional than the non-union store. The prices are the same.

GoU
Are all Albertson's non-union?

I pretty much have them or super-mini-wannabe-wal-mart (super Target). The cool local owned grocery that we talked about (Rouses) is too far for weekly convenience. In fact, I've only been there once. Winn-Dixie sucks. Super 1 is not for every week. And Pigly Wiggly is again on the outskirts of town (other direction).

-P

User avatar
Bernie the union guy
Site Admin
Posts: 3476
Joined: Mon Jun 06, 2011 10:48 pm
Location: The land of perpetual Lent! (aka Cincinnati)

Re: "My employees are largely responsible for any success...

Post by Bernie the union guy »

Let me pass on another Personal aside...
It was another Kroger's store that my daughter shopped at that... in the end of a hectic year... long story to many on this board, but very personal to those who know... got together with community to bring Santa to visit my home for the kids and spend an afternoon telling stories in my chair in front of a burning fireplace. It was an absolutely enjoyable time, and it took the stress off of the kids and us.
At the same time they were filling the freezer and fridge with donated food and milk, and the pantry with dry goods and canned items.

They did that, wallyworld did nuthing.... NOTHING!

I know who was in the Santa's clothing...
But they knew nothing of my having Kroger's stock.

It's Family! My Family!

Now...
For the thread...
When the ownership is shared by the employees... Like Kroger's... a close bond is made. Been there... done that...
When the community suffers... all pitch in and share and do what they can...

Wallyworld just sits there and sells it's garbage... and does nothing but put's it's name on things...
NOTHING!
Bernie...
“The mountains are calling... and i must go." John Muir

Image

~katie~
Member
Posts: 56
Joined: Wed Sep 21, 2011 1:14 am

Re: "My employees are largely responsible for any success...

Post by ~katie~ »

What a cool story!
"Let the disappointments pass, let the laughter fill your glass" ~Jackson Browne~

gounion
Board Emeritus
Posts: 36621
Joined: Wed May 04, 2011 11:26 pm

Re: "My employees are largely responsible for any success...

Post by gounion »

plunderer » Mon Nov 26, 2012 12:44 am wrote: Are all Albertson's non-union?

I pretty much have them or super-mini-wannabe-wal-mart (super Target). The cool local owned grocery that we talked about (Rouses) is too far for weekly convenience. In fact, I've only been there once. Winn-Dixie sucks. Super 1 is not for every week. And Pigly Wiggly is again on the outskirts of town (other direction).

-P
If you don't have a Kroger, I doubt you have any union grocery stores in your area. I was unable to find a UFCW local in your area, either.

GoU

Ike Bana
Board Emeritus
Posts: 20776
Joined: Tue Feb 28, 2012 11:01 pm

Re: "My employees are largely responsible for any success...

Post by Ike Bana »

Bull...this was your question:
My only question is at what rate should this gentleman be taxed after he sells his business?
The only answer to your only question is: at the applicable tax according to the current tax code.

If you have a comment to make, make a comment. If you have a question to ask, ask a question. Your original posted "question" is clearly a bullshit game. Say what you mean, mean what you say.[/quote]

I wasn't asking what the current tax code says, why would I ask anyone here that? I asked what in their opinion the man
SHOULD
be taxed.
Another words in your opinion what should the man be taxed. Why was that so difficult for you to understand? He obviously understood my question as he answered it. Try to pay attention.[/quote]

Wrong. Then the question would have been: At what rate would you prefer to see this gentleman be taxed after he sells his business?

He should be taxed per the tax code.

Try to learn to speak the language.

PS - try to learn how to use the "quote" feature.

minsocal
Board Emeritus
Posts: 7380
Joined: Wed Jun 08, 2011 3:23 pm

Re: "My employees are largely responsible for any success...

Post by minsocal »

The turnover to the employees will take five years. In each of those years the owner will be allowed a tax deduction for the amount taken on by the employees. This is governed by formula in the tax code. The ESOP tax incentives are designed to create a win-win situation for employees and owner(s). This way the owner gets a tax break and, as stated in the OP, is assured that the company is turned over to the employees, avoiding the risk of selling the company to an ouside entity that could make wholesale changes.
"To Be Is to Do" - Plato
"To Do Is to Be" - Socrates
"Do-Be-Do-Be-Do" - Sinatra

User avatar
kempster
Policy Wonk
Posts: 1566
Joined: Tue Jun 21, 2011 9:46 am

Re: "My employees are largely responsible for any success...

Post by kempster »

independent thinker » Mon Nov 26, 2012 9:15 am wrote:
The thread is basically you using a story to attack the "right wing". Every thread you start is in some way an attack on others. Since you have such a love affair with the guy I was wondering

He did build it. In your mind who built it? If he wasn't there investing and making decisions would the company just sprout and grow on its own? Did the government build it? Did a group of employees just band together and naturally form a business that was successful enough to grow? He was the most intergal part of the companies success, without him there would be no company.

If you want to tax him at the regular tax rate then you need to figure a way for him to tally the endless hours he spent where he didn't receive houly compensation. He recieved no guarantee that the investment he made would profit him anything. If we had a flate rate tax system then maybe you have a point.


There is no doubt the tax code needs to be thoroughly revised from top to bottom, but class warfare is not a path to prosperity for anyone. Do you believe the poor are better served by a "fair" tax code or one that brings in more revenue, which in turn benefits the poor?
Hmmmmmmmmm............ according to the guy...... it was the workers.........cheers boot.
24 hours in a day, 24 beers in a case. Coincidence.....I think not!

User avatar
miwingman
Policy Wonk
Posts: 2307
Joined: Wed Jun 15, 2011 8:17 am

Re: "My employees are largely responsible for any success...

Post by miwingman »

gounion » Mon Nov 26, 2012 1:16 am wrote:They built a new (unionized) Kroger right around the corner from my house. I love it. It's far superior in products and services to the (non-union) Albertsons that is nearby. The service and checkouts are also better, faster, friendlier and more professional than the non-union store. The prices are the same.

GoU
You should thank Kroger management.

minsocal
Board Emeritus
Posts: 7380
Joined: Wed Jun 08, 2011 3:23 pm

Re: "My employees are largely responsible for any success...

Post by minsocal »

gounion » Mon Nov 26, 2012 1:16 am wrote:They built a new (unionized) Kroger right around the corner from my house. I love it. It's far superior in products and services to the (non-union) Albertsons that is nearby. The service and checkouts are also better, faster, friendlier and more professional than the non-union store. The prices are the same.

GoU
Near me I have a Ralphs, La Caretta, Albertsons and Stater Brothers within walking distance. Stater Brothers is union and their parking lot is full most of the time they are open. The others are struggling. Stater has the best prices, the best customer service, and the best selection. The Albertsons has four automated checkout machines which seem to be more trouble than they are worth. It's interesting to watch the Albertsons employees hovering around the automated checkout machines to assist those customers while everyone else gets ignored. Wierd business.
"To Be Is to Do" - Plato
"To Do Is to Be" - Socrates
"Do-Be-Do-Be-Do" - Sinatra

gounion
Board Emeritus
Posts: 36621
Joined: Wed May 04, 2011 11:26 pm

Re: "My employees are largely responsible for any success...

Post by gounion »

miwingman » Mon Nov 26, 2012 9:04 pm wrote:
You should thank Kroger management.
Kroger seems to be quite well-managed. Plus, they get the best employees because they pay more than the other stores. As in anything else, you get what you pay for. Well-paid employees MAKE you money, it doesn't cost you money. That's what Walmart doesn't understand.

GoU

User avatar
Majesty
Board Emeritus
Posts: 6392
Joined: Sun Jun 19, 2011 9:36 pm

Re: "My employees are largely responsible for any success...

Post by Majesty »

gounion » Mon Nov 26, 2012 10:41 pm wrote: Kroger seems to be quite well-managed. Plus, they get the best employees because they pay more than the other stores. As in anything else, you get what you pay for. Well-paid employees MAKE you money, it doesn't cost you money. That's what Walmart doesn't understand.

GoU
If that's true they will fail, no?

Hardly seems worth unleashing your venom.
Peace Sells...but who's buying?

gounion
Board Emeritus
Posts: 36621
Joined: Wed May 04, 2011 11:26 pm

Re: "My employees are largely responsible for any success...

Post by gounion »

Majesty » Mon Nov 26, 2012 9:44 pm wrote: If that's true they will fail, no?

Hardly seems worth unleashing your venom.
They certainly pay a lot more in training than Costco does, because Costco doesn't have the turnover. Last I heard, Walmart had something like 2.5 times turnover in one year. In other words, they turn over the workforce two and a half times. Lots of waste there. It'd be better if they paid enough that people would stay.

Costco makes more profit per employee that Sam's Club, the Walmart-owned direct competitor to Costco. They pay more, and pay health care, but they make more.

Interesting that you say GC pays you so well, but you champion low-wage employers. Maybe, when GC goes down, you'll say it's because you were overpaid and didn't carry your weight.

GoU

User avatar
Majesty
Board Emeritus
Posts: 6392
Joined: Sun Jun 19, 2011 9:36 pm

Re: "My employees are largely responsible for any success...

Post by Majesty »

gounion » Mon Nov 26, 2012 10:52 pm wrote: They certainly pay a lot more in training than Costco does, because Costco doesn't have the turnover. Last I heard, Walmart had something like 2.5 times turnover in one year. In other words, they turn over the workforce two and a half times. Lots of waste there. It'd be better if they paid enough that people would stay.

Costco makes more profit per employee that Sam's Club, the Walmart-owned direct competitor to Costco. They pay more, and pay health care, but they make more.

Interesting that you say GC pays you so well, but you champion low-wage employers. Maybe, when GC goes down, you'll say it's because you were overpaid and didn't carry your weight.

GoU
What low-wage employers do I champion and how do I champion them?
Peace Sells...but who's buying?

gounion
Board Emeritus
Posts: 36621
Joined: Wed May 04, 2011 11:26 pm

Re: "My employees are largely responsible for any success...

Post by gounion »

Majesty » Mon Nov 26, 2012 10:00 pm wrote: What low-wage employers do I champion and how do I champion them?
You just championed Walmart, in your usual passive/aggressive form.

GoU

User avatar
Majesty
Board Emeritus
Posts: 6392
Joined: Sun Jun 19, 2011 9:36 pm

Re: "My employees are largely responsible for any success...

Post by Majesty »

gounion » Mon Nov 26, 2012 11:02 pm wrote: You just championed Walmart, in your usual passive/aggressive form.

GoU
I like Walmart because I can buy things I need for not a lot of money. That is hardly championing.
Peace Sells...but who's buying?

gounion
Board Emeritus
Posts: 36621
Joined: Wed May 04, 2011 11:26 pm

Re: "My employees are largely responsible for any success...

Post by gounion »

Majesty » Mon Nov 26, 2012 10:03 pm wrote: I like Walmart because I can buy things I need for not a lot of money. That is hardly championing.
That's because the taxpayer underwrites Walmart.

GoU

minsocal
Board Emeritus
Posts: 7380
Joined: Wed Jun 08, 2011 3:23 pm

Re: "My employees are largely responsible for any success...

Post by minsocal »

Majesty » Mon Nov 26, 2012 11:03 pm wrote: I like Walmart because I can buy things I need for not a lot of money. That is hardly championing.
I'm waiting to buy a Fender guitar until they come from China.
"To Be Is to Do" - Plato
"To Do Is to Be" - Socrates
"Do-Be-Do-Be-Do" - Sinatra

User avatar
Majesty
Board Emeritus
Posts: 6392
Joined: Sun Jun 19, 2011 9:36 pm

Re: "My employees are largely responsible for any success...

Post by Majesty »

minsocal » Mon Nov 26, 2012 11:17 pm wrote:
I'm waiting to buy a Fender guitar until they come from China.
Image

There ya go, pal. That will be $609.99.
Peace Sells...but who's buying?

gounion
Board Emeritus
Posts: 36621
Joined: Wed May 04, 2011 11:26 pm

Re: "My employees are largely responsible for any success...

Post by gounion »

Majesty » Mon Nov 26, 2012 10:03 pm wrote: I like Walmart because I can buy things I need for not a lot of money. That is hardly championing.
And while you buy all your cheap stuff at Walmart, don't give a thought to the 112 people in Bangledesh that died making it:

NGOs slammed Walmart over a fire that killed at least 112 workers at a Bangladesh factory that supplied apparel for the retail giant. While Walmart says it has not confirmed that it has any relationship to the factory, photos provided to The Nation show piles of clothes made for one of its exclusive brands.

In a statement e-mailed Sunday night, Walmart expressed sympathy for the victims’ families, and said that it was “trying to determine if the factory has a current relationship with Walmart or one of our suppliers…” The company called fire safety “a critically important area of Walmart’s factory audit program,” and said that it has been “working across the apparel industry to improve fire safety education and training in Bangladesh.” Walmart added that it has “partnered with several independent organizations to develop and roll out fire safety training tools for factory management and workers.”

But in a Monday interview, Workers Rights Consortium Executive Director Scott Nova said Walmart’s “culpability is enormous. First of all they are the largest buyer from Bangladesh” and so “they make the market.” Nova said Bangladesh has become the world's second largest apparel supplier "because they’ve given Walmart and its competitors what they want, which is the cheapest possible labor costs.”

“So Walmart is supporting, is incentivizing, an industry strategy in Bangladesh: extreme low wages, non-existent regulation, brutal suppression of any attempt by workers to act collectively to improve wages and conditions,” Nova told The Nation. “This factory is a product of that strategy that Walmart invites, supports, and perpetuates.” The WRC is a labor monitoring group whose board is composed of students, labor organizations, and university administrators.

*snip*

But photos taken after the fire taken the Bangladesh Center for Worker Solidarity, provided to The Nation by the International Labor Rights Forum, show clothing with Walmart’s exclusive Faded Glory label (photos below). Nova accused Walmart of intentionally dragging its feet on admitting its connection to the factory, in hopes that by the time the connection is confirmed, the media will have lost interest.


Image

GoU

User avatar
Majesty
Board Emeritus
Posts: 6392
Joined: Sun Jun 19, 2011 9:36 pm

Re: "My employees are largely responsible for any success...

Post by Majesty »

Would my not buying something at Walmart bring back the dead? No. It wouldn't. I have done all the guilt I intend to do in my life. I will not do any more.
Peace Sells...but who's buying?

gounion
Board Emeritus
Posts: 36621
Joined: Wed May 04, 2011 11:26 pm

Re: "My employees are largely responsible for any success...

Post by gounion »

Majesty » Mon Nov 26, 2012 10:36 pm wrote:
Would my not buying something at Walmart bring back the dead? No. It wouldn't. I have done all the guilt I intend to do in my life. I will not do any more.
Yep, you don't care how many die, as long as it's cheap. You don't care how many slaves it takes to make it. You don't care how many small children work 14 hours a day, 7 days a week.

Just as long as it's cheap.

Conservatives: They don't give a shit for ANYONE but themselves.

GoU

User avatar
Majesty
Board Emeritus
Posts: 6392
Joined: Sun Jun 19, 2011 9:36 pm

Re: "My employees are largely responsible for any success...

Post by Majesty »

gounion » Mon Nov 26, 2012 11:41 pm wrote:Yep, you don't care how many die, as long as it's cheap. You don't care how many slaves it takes to make it. You don't care how many small children work 14 hours a day, 7 days a week.

Just as long as it's cheap.

Conservatives: They don't give a shit for ANYONE but themselves.

GoU
You didn't answer my question.
Peace Sells...but who's buying?

gounion
Board Emeritus
Posts: 36621
Joined: Wed May 04, 2011 11:26 pm

Re: "My employees are largely responsible for any success...

Post by gounion »

Majesty » Mon Nov 26, 2012 10:43 pm wrote: You didn't answer my question.
It seemed to be a rhetorical question, to denote the fact that you don't give a shit how much blood is on the product, if it's cheap, you're good.

GoU

Post Reply