Obama: "I underestimated" disinformation's threat to democracies

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Libertas
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Obama: "I underestimated" disinformation's threat to democracies

Post by Libertas »

Obama: "I underestimated" disinformation's threat to democracies


Shawna Chen at Axios

https://www.axios.com/obama-disinformat ... 80114.html


"SNIP.......

What he's saying: "If you asked me what I'm most concerned about when I think back toward the end of my presidency, it probably has more to do with the topic here today," Obama said Wednesday at a conference on disinformation presented by The Atlantic and the University of Chicago Institute of Politics.

* "It's something I grappled with a lot during my presidency.

* I saw it sort of unfold, and that is the degree to which information, disinformation, misinformation was being weaponized."

* "And we saw it, but I think I underestimated the degree to which democracies were as vulnerable to it as they were, including ours," he noted.

* 4Misinformation is "wrong information," but disinformation is "a systematic effort to either promote false information, to suppress true information, for the purpose of political gain, financial gain, enhancing power, suppressing others, targeting those you don't like," he said."

It is difficult for me to see how we win the contest of ideas if in fact we are not able to agree on a baseline of facts that allow the marketplace of ideas to work."

We see it here all day long. Rightwingers and their pretend friends do nothing but misinform and be misinformed.
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carmenjonze
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Re: Obama: "I underestimated" disinformation's threat to democracies

Post by carmenjonze »

He and a lot of liberals did.

It's like people learned nothing from People's Temple, Heaven's Gate, 7 Mountains Evangelicalism, Domnionism, 9/11 trooth, Waco, the Weavers, the militia movement and other conspiracy-minded elements of the past 40 years. :?
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Re: Obama: "I underestimated" disinformation's threat to democracies

Post by Glennfs »

carmenjonze wrote: Wed Apr 06, 2022 11:07 pm He and a lot of liberals did.

It's like people learned nothing from People's Temple, Heaven's Gate, 7 Mountains Evangelicalism, Domnionism, 9/11 trooth, Waco, the Weavers, the militia movement and other conspiracy-minded elements of the past 40 years. :?

https://www.wsj.com/articles/mainstream ... 1636991841

An opinion piece but the instances of fake news cited all true
" I am a socialist " Bernie Sanders
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Re: Obama: "I underestimated" disinformation's threat to democracies

Post by gounion »

Glennfs wrote: Thu Apr 07, 2022 7:57 am https://www.wsj.com/articles/mainstream ... 1636991841

An opinion piece but the instances of fake news cited all true
No, not all true. Let's remember the opinion page of the WSJ is the most far-right place possible.

So, now are you saying that Trump DIDN'T call the Nazis at Charlottesville "very fine people"?
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Re: Obama: "I underestimated" disinformation's threat to democracies

Post by carmenjonze »

Glennfs wrote: Thu Apr 07, 2022 7:57 am https://www.wsj.com/articles/mainstream ... 1636991841

An opinion piece but the instances of fake news cited all true
I don’t click on random opinion page links from white supremacists.

Who’s the article by, and what’s the relevance to what I said?
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Re: Obama: "I underestimated" disinformation's threat to democracies

Post by Glennfs »

carmenjonze wrote: Thu Apr 07, 2022 8:08 am I don’t click on random opinion page links from white supremacists.

Who’s the article by, and what’s the relevance to what I said?
Sorry next time I will attempt to find a link from a socialist organization
" I am a socialist " Bernie Sanders
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Re: Obama: "I underestimated" disinformation's threat to democracies

Post by Glennfs »

gounion wrote: Thu Apr 07, 2022 8:06 am No, not all true. Let's remember the opinion page of the WSJ is the most far-right place possible.

So, now are you saying that Trump DIDN'T call the Nazis at Charlottesville "very fine people"?
If you are going to complain about opinion pieces I post then quit being a hypocrite and start complaining about all opinion pieces
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Re: Obama: "I underestimated" disinformation's threat to democracies

Post by gounion »

Glennfs wrote: Thu Apr 07, 2022 10:07 am If you are going to complain about opinion pieces I post then quit being a hypocrite and start complaining about all opinion pieces
Sorry, but you’re the hypocrite here.
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Re: Obama: "I underestimated" disinformation's threat to democracies

Post by carmenjonze »

Glennfs wrote: Thu Apr 07, 2022 10:06 am Sorry next time I will attempt to find a link from a socialist organization
Try finding a credible link and saying how it’s even relevant to what you’re responding to, instead of being an undereducated con, too ignorant lazy to do anything beyond copy/pasting the first random link you found in n Google.

Start with that. What is your opinion piece link about?
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Libertas
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Re: Obama: "I underestimated" disinformation's threat to democracies

Post by Libertas »

carmenjonze wrote: Thu Apr 07, 2022 10:32 am Try finding a credible link and saying how it’s even relevant to what you’re responding to, instead of being an undereducated con, too ignorant lazy to do anything beyond copy/pasting the first random link you found in n Google.

Start with that. What is your opinion piece link about?
Here is why this is a waste of time, this CHILD just said "socialist" :roll:

Adam Kinzinger just gave a speech about leaving the House because the GOP are "children."


https://www.independent.co.uk/news/worl ... 51683.html

Board con enables these "children."
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Re: Obama: "I underestimated" disinformation's threat to democracies

Post by ZoWie »

Russia weaponized information in 1914. They've had nothing but practice and refinement since.

We lost our edge, took their trolling bait hook line and sinker, and consensus became impossible as a result of that and some badly conceived wars in Asia and the Middle East. Now Russia has fallen into the badly conceived war trap, but with their command of disinformation we're not doing much to take advantage of it.

A good start would be educating a critical mass of people on the best tactics for fighting foreign disinfo ops. Dropping the more obvious offenders such as RT and Sputnik is not really a good start, because that's the old paradigm of propaganda and the new paradigm of propaganda is a lot more sophisticated.

An example of the old kind is "Nazis in Ukraine." Nobody buys that. An example of the new kind is how most of the election agitprop from Russian troll farms was about reinforcing racial and religious mistrust. We see that playing out daily.
"We must remember that we cannot abandon the truth and remain a free nation." --Liz Cheney, Republican, 7/21/22
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Re: Obama: "I underestimated" disinformation's threat to democracies

Post by carmenjonze »

Libertas wrote: Thu Apr 07, 2022 11:07 am Here is why this is a waste of time, this CHILD just said "socialist" :roll:

Adam Kinzinger just gave a speech about leaving the House because the GOP are "children."


https://www.independent.co.uk/news/worl ... 51683.html

Board con enables these "children."
The only thing these people are good for is violence and backlash, which is just more violence.

They’re capable of better but they choose this crappy lifestyle.
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The way to right wrongs is to
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~ Ida B. Wells
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Re: Obama: "I underestimated" disinformation's threat to democracies

Post by Motor City »

carmenjonze wrote: Wed Apr 06, 2022 11:07 pm He and a lot of liberals did.

It's like people learned nothing from People's Temple, Heaven's Gate, 7 Mountains Evangelicalism, Domnionism, 9/11 trooth, Waco, the Weavers, the militia movement and other conspiracy-minded elements of the past 40 years. :?
remember that one guy Bill he came from the tabloid television show inside edition
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Re: Obama: "I underestimated" disinformation's threat to democracies

Post by ProfX »

This seems like a good thread to deal with the origins of disinformation surrounding Hunter Biden.

The "Hunter-China stuff" did not come from Russia - but maybe from a not much better source: a Chinese tycoon and Steve Bannon.

Exclusive: Leaked Messages Reveal the Origins of the Most Vile Hunter Biden Smear
Fugitive Chinese tycoon and Steve Bannon ally Guo Wengui pushed out explicit material—and lies—on the eve of the 2020 election.

https://www.motherjones.com/politics/20 ... -giuliani/

Late in the 2020 presidential campaign, trailing in the polls, Donald Trump and his allies worked to make a campaign issue out of a trove of files on a laptop that his opponent’s son, Hunter Biden, had apparently abandoned at a Delaware repair shop. The effort to publicize compromising emails, images, and videos from the device involved prominent Trump confidants including Rudy Giuliani and Steven Bannon. But it also featured an unexpected player: Guo Wengui, a fugitive Chinese tycoon who was working with Bannon to build a small empire of Chinese-language media outlets, nonprofits, and other ventures.

Mother Jones obtained scores of WhatsApp audio messages Guo sent to supporters, along with underlying material from Biden’s hard drive that Guo’s assistant distributed at his behest. Previous reports have noted the role of Guo allies and companies in publicizing sex tapes and other material involving Hunter Biden. But the WhatsApp messages, and sources who were involved in the effort, reveal that Guo—who has been accused in lawsuits of fraud and rape and of secretly acting as an agent for the Chinese Communist Party—played a larger role than previously known in ensuring that explicit images and videos from the laptop appeared online, and in spreading lies about them. (Guo has denied the allegations made in the lawsuits against him.)

Guo stage-managed an October 2020 effort to disseminate videos and pictures showing Hunter Biden engaged in sex acts and using drugs. After Giuliani, then President Trump’s personal lawyer, gave him material from Hunter Biden’s laptop, Guo issued detailed instructions to two WhatsApp groups that included dozens of Guo’s supporters. Guo directed these supporters to package, post, and promote hundreds of explicit images and other material about Biden on websites Guo controlled, people involved in the effort said.

The material Guo publicized seems to be real, but he instructed supporters to couple it with false claims that it came from Chinese sources, and that the Chinese government had used it to obtain leverage over Hunter Biden and his father, Joe Biden. “We have to express…The Chinese Communist Party used these to threaten Hunter and [Joe] Biden,” Guo told supporters in an October 24, 2020, message. (Mother Jones is quoting English translations of messages that were originally in Chinese. Multiple people independently verified the translations.)

People who helped Guo publish the material online said that it quickly became clear to them that he was lying about China’s role. “They tried to link the Biden family to the [Chinese Communist Party],” said a person involved in the effort, who shared Guo’s WhatsApp messages with Mother Jones and requested anonymity. “They wanted to help Trump win.”

[snip]

Guo, facing Chinese efforts to have him extradited, hired Bannon in 2018. The conservative strategist, who was ousted from a job as a top White House aide in 2017, helped Guo set up nonprofit organizations and media companies, including a website called GNews and GTV, a mostly Chinese-language video streaming site. Guo used this network to advance bizarre, false conspiracy theories about Covid and other topics. (He claimed last year that China is manipulating Covid vaccines in a plot to kill Jews, because “the CCP wants to gain control of all aspects of the world, and the Jews are in their way.”) By the fall of 2020, Guo’s network, though nominally aimed at overthrowing China’s government, was also aggressively supporting Trump’s reelection bid.

[snip]

While he orchestrated the publication of the Hunter Biden material, Guo encouraged supporters to make a false, vile claim. He instructed them to say the laptop included videos that showed Hunter Biden having sex with underage Chinese girls, according to messages he sent and people who communicated with him. Guo also asserted, baselessly, that the Chinese government had created or obtained the compromising videos and images and used them to blackmail the Bidens. Wang Dinggang repeated both of those claims in his September 25 broadcasts. They were later parroted on GNews. No evidence whatsoever supports these allegations. “It was a lie. In all the pictures, we didn’t see any Asians, so how could the CCP have taken all the pictures?” one of the people involved in distributing the material said.

These lies dovetailed with the QAnon conspiracy theory, which holds that many prominent Democrats are pedophiles and that Trump was working to stop them. And they were echoed by Giuliani, who falsely asserted on Newsmax on October 20, 2020, that Biden’s laptop contained “numerous pictures of underage girls.” These bogus claims took off online, with far-right sites amplifying them. QAnon devotees in the fall of 2020 also pushed the claim that Joe Biden himself was a pedophile, a smear that Giuliani also appeared to bolster on Twitter in the final days of the 2020 campaign.

[snip][end]
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Libertas
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Re: Obama: "I underestimated" disinformation's threat to democracies

Post by Libertas »

I remember when I first heard of the Hillary email story, it was clear that day there was no story, at all.

I was right, there was no story, at all. But I was not surprised when I watched something that didnt happen destroy a great American, and the worst possible scenario of what happened if true, would not warrant a mention if done by trump, given on an average day he commits so many actual crimes.

It was understandable for politicians in the GOP to lie about it and use it, but what is unforgiveable is to watch their voters like the ones here do the lying also. To promote stories that are not true, to destroy good people.

They really our the enemy of the human race.
I sigh in your general direction.
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