Oglala Sioux ban missionary, require ministries to register
The Oglala Sioux Tribe is requiring churches and missionaries to register with the tribe before entering the Pine Ridge Indian Reservation in South Dakota
https://abcnews.go.com/US/wireStory/ogl ... r-87897710
SIOUX FALLS, S.D. -- The Oglala Sioux Tribe is requiring churches and missionaries to register with the tribe before entering the Pine Ridge Indian Reservation in South Dakota after an evangelist was banned from entering the reservation for distributing a pamphlet that disparaged traditional Lakota spirituality.
The tribal ordinance, which does not apply to local churches and ministries run by tribal members, was passed in late July amid concern from some tribal council members over Christian ministries evangelizing on the reservation, working with children as well as a history of abuse against Native Americans by some churches. The tribe's leadership has insisted it remains open to all religions, in keeping with its Bill of Rights, but the action showed significant pushback against some Christian missionary groups.
“The history of abuses by the churches on Indigenous peoples has caused generational trauma to Indigenous peoples across the world,” the tribal council stated in its ordinance.
The council's actions were prompted by a South Dakota group called Jesus is King Missions creating a pamphlet that called Tunkasila a false god or demon, South Dakota Public Broadcasting reported. It also claimed that the late Lakota medicine man Nicholas Black Elk, who converted to Catholicism and continued to practice Lakota ceremonies, had a “racist vision.”
“According to the Bible, Jesus is the way, the truth and the life and no one comes to the Father but by him,” said Michael Monfore, a missionary with the group. “I know that may not be considered politically correct, or it might be considered intolerant or bigoted, but that’s what Christ said.”
The tribe has banned Monfore from entering the reservation.
[snip][end]
Churches cooperated with setting up many of the boarding schools that Native children were kidnapped to and abused on in the U.S. - and Canada, as the Pope just apologized.
BTW, they are not banning churches or missionaries from the rez. They probably couldn't, tribal sovereignty doesn't exempt them from federal law. However, they are going to make them register and get permission from the tribal gov't first - and they should.
Pine Ridge Rez Restricts Xian Missionaries
Pine Ridge Rez Restricts Xian Missionaries
"Don't believe every quote attributed to people on the Internet" -- Abraham Lincoln 
-
carmenjonze
- Posts: 9614
- Joined: Mon Oct 25, 2021 3:06 am
Re: Pine Ridge Rez Restricts Xian Missionaries
Bye, colonizer.ProfX wrote: ↑Sat Aug 06, 2022 2:09 pm
The council's actions were prompted by a South Dakota group called Jesus is King Missions creating a pamphlet that called Tunkasila a false god or demon, South Dakota Public Broadcasting reported. It also claimed that the late Lakota medicine man Nicholas Black Elk, who converted to Catholicism and continued to practice Lakota ceremonies, had a “racist vision.”
“According to the Bible, Jesus is the way, the truth and the life and no one comes to the Father but by him,” said Michael Monfore, a missionary with the group. “I know that may not be considered politically correct, or it might be considered intolerant or bigoted, but that’s what Christ said.”
________________________________
The way to right wrongs is to
Shine the light of truth on them.
~ Ida B. Wells
________________________________
The way to right wrongs is to
Shine the light of truth on them.
~ Ida B. Wells
________________________________
Re: Pine Ridge Rez Restricts Xian Missionaries
https://www.americamagazine.org/arts-cu ... ll-jesuits
The true ordeal of the Teton Lakota, the warrior tribe that whipped the U.S. Cavalry in several notable fights in the 1870s, began after the shooting stopped. Worse than the persistent hunger was the federal effort to “civilize” the Indians by stages into hat- and trouser-wearing farmers with one wife, Christian first names, fixed last names and children who learned English in school. But the authorities had one aim above all others—to end the ancient practice of smoking a traditional pipe with a mixture of tobacco and the inner bark of the red willow before calling out to the ultimate power behind all things addressed by Lakota as Tunkashila. The Lakota resisted all of these changes but clung to nothing more tenaciously than the pipe.
The Oglala holy man and healer known as Black Elk once said that Lakota used tunkashila, which means grandfather, as a sign of respect and intimacy. The word, with the accent on the second syllable, is not the name of God, who has no name in traditional Lakota religion but is simply described as Wakan Tanka, translated by convention into English as Great Spirit. But wakan is a heavily freighted word. It means spirit in the sense of immaterial, large, eternal and everywhere, but it also means ancient, unknowable, mysterious and powerful.
The Lakota wakan tanka in some particulars resembles the traditional Judeo-Christian-Muslim god—knows everything, is the source of everything, can be reached by prayer—but was held in suspicion by the Christian churches that established themselves on the Lakota reservations in South Dakota. To defend the primacy of the Bible the churches persuaded the federal authorities by the early 1880s to impose a Code of Indian Offenses with reservation courts to try, convict and punish offenses that were all religious or cultural in nature. Outlawed for the next 50 years were the sun dance, traditional medicine, use of a sweat lodge for purification, plural marriages and dispersal of personal property at death in a ceremony known as a giveaway. Officials intended to extinguish every aspect of Indian culture root and branch, starting with native languages.
Both witness and victim of this long ordeal was the Oglala Black Elk, who took the Christian name of Nicholas, became a Catholic in about 1904 and served as a catechist until 1930, when his life took a dramatic turn recorded by Joe Jackson in a book that is not only an exhaustive biography but the best account we have of what it meant for Northern Plains Indians to watch their children stripped of everything their fathers had believed. Both sides of this story are included—the religion Black Elk tried to preserve, and the battle for his allegiance waged by Jesuit priests who felt betrayed by his late-life return to the old ways.
The struggle began in 1930 when Black Elk at 67, fearing that traditional pipe religion would die with him, elected to tell the Nebraska poet John Neihardt about the central religious experience of his life—an elaborate vision he had experienced when he was 9 years old. Neihardt devoted the longest chapter of his book, Black Elk Speaks, to this vision, which has poetic splendor but is not easily summarized. At the heart of it is an account of the religious crisis faced by the Lakota people and of the charge placed upon Black Elk personally by the Six Grandfathers to restore the sacred hoop of life and the flowering tree at its center. Black Elk described all of it in a non-stop, three-week interview with Neihardt. Just as remarkable was Neihardt’s effort to record the vision faithfully.
When Black Elk Speaks was published in 1932 the holy man’s vision was the big central thing, followed by a more conventional account of his role in the major episodes of Oglala Lakota history, from his birth in 1863 through the massacre known as Wounded Knee in 1890. New to the story is Jackson’s account of Black Elk’s season with Buffalo Bill’s Wild West show in Europe 1887. After missing the boat home, he lived in France for a year, falling in love and fathering a child.
[snip]
But more important than placing Black Elk is what he managed to save. The vision he described for Neihardt, and later amplified for another scholar who came to his door, Joseph Epes Brown, preserves a clear account of a body of religious thinking that officials wanted to scrub from Lakota memory. The old-time Lakota always believed that it was the warriors who would save them. What Black Elk taught his people was to depend instead on something harder to take away than guns, the trust that prayers in their own language, delivered in their own way, would reach the god they addressed as Tunkashila.
[snip][end]
In a country that claims to value religious freedom, it tried to exterminate the Lakota religion.
Dunno what problem this guy has with Black Elk, but he tried to preserve it before the washichu destroyed it.
Yes, Black Elk was nominally a Catholic, but continued to practice his traditional Native faith at the same time. That's a familiar story to me, reminds me of Cuban "Catholics" who still practice Santeria, or Haitian ones who practice Voudoun.
The true ordeal of the Teton Lakota, the warrior tribe that whipped the U.S. Cavalry in several notable fights in the 1870s, began after the shooting stopped. Worse than the persistent hunger was the federal effort to “civilize” the Indians by stages into hat- and trouser-wearing farmers with one wife, Christian first names, fixed last names and children who learned English in school. But the authorities had one aim above all others—to end the ancient practice of smoking a traditional pipe with a mixture of tobacco and the inner bark of the red willow before calling out to the ultimate power behind all things addressed by Lakota as Tunkashila. The Lakota resisted all of these changes but clung to nothing more tenaciously than the pipe.
The Oglala holy man and healer known as Black Elk once said that Lakota used tunkashila, which means grandfather, as a sign of respect and intimacy. The word, with the accent on the second syllable, is not the name of God, who has no name in traditional Lakota religion but is simply described as Wakan Tanka, translated by convention into English as Great Spirit. But wakan is a heavily freighted word. It means spirit in the sense of immaterial, large, eternal and everywhere, but it also means ancient, unknowable, mysterious and powerful.
The Lakota wakan tanka in some particulars resembles the traditional Judeo-Christian-Muslim god—knows everything, is the source of everything, can be reached by prayer—but was held in suspicion by the Christian churches that established themselves on the Lakota reservations in South Dakota. To defend the primacy of the Bible the churches persuaded the federal authorities by the early 1880s to impose a Code of Indian Offenses with reservation courts to try, convict and punish offenses that were all religious or cultural in nature. Outlawed for the next 50 years were the sun dance, traditional medicine, use of a sweat lodge for purification, plural marriages and dispersal of personal property at death in a ceremony known as a giveaway. Officials intended to extinguish every aspect of Indian culture root and branch, starting with native languages.
Both witness and victim of this long ordeal was the Oglala Black Elk, who took the Christian name of Nicholas, became a Catholic in about 1904 and served as a catechist until 1930, when his life took a dramatic turn recorded by Joe Jackson in a book that is not only an exhaustive biography but the best account we have of what it meant for Northern Plains Indians to watch their children stripped of everything their fathers had believed. Both sides of this story are included—the religion Black Elk tried to preserve, and the battle for his allegiance waged by Jesuit priests who felt betrayed by his late-life return to the old ways.
The struggle began in 1930 when Black Elk at 67, fearing that traditional pipe religion would die with him, elected to tell the Nebraska poet John Neihardt about the central religious experience of his life—an elaborate vision he had experienced when he was 9 years old. Neihardt devoted the longest chapter of his book, Black Elk Speaks, to this vision, which has poetic splendor but is not easily summarized. At the heart of it is an account of the religious crisis faced by the Lakota people and of the charge placed upon Black Elk personally by the Six Grandfathers to restore the sacred hoop of life and the flowering tree at its center. Black Elk described all of it in a non-stop, three-week interview with Neihardt. Just as remarkable was Neihardt’s effort to record the vision faithfully.
When Black Elk Speaks was published in 1932 the holy man’s vision was the big central thing, followed by a more conventional account of his role in the major episodes of Oglala Lakota history, from his birth in 1863 through the massacre known as Wounded Knee in 1890. New to the story is Jackson’s account of Black Elk’s season with Buffalo Bill’s Wild West show in Europe 1887. After missing the boat home, he lived in France for a year, falling in love and fathering a child.
[snip]
But more important than placing Black Elk is what he managed to save. The vision he described for Neihardt, and later amplified for another scholar who came to his door, Joseph Epes Brown, preserves a clear account of a body of religious thinking that officials wanted to scrub from Lakota memory. The old-time Lakota always believed that it was the warriors who would save them. What Black Elk taught his people was to depend instead on something harder to take away than guns, the trust that prayers in their own language, delivered in their own way, would reach the god they addressed as Tunkashila.
[snip][end]
In a country that claims to value religious freedom, it tried to exterminate the Lakota religion.
Dunno what problem this guy has with Black Elk, but he tried to preserve it before the washichu destroyed it.
Yes, Black Elk was nominally a Catholic, but continued to practice his traditional Native faith at the same time. That's a familiar story to me, reminds me of Cuban "Catholics" who still practice Santeria, or Haitian ones who practice Voudoun.
"Don't believe every quote attributed to people on the Internet" -- Abraham Lincoln
-
carmenjonze
- Posts: 9614
- Joined: Mon Oct 25, 2021 3:06 am
Re: Pine Ridge Rez Restricts Xian Missionaries
Catholiicism and its saints lends itself to religions with pantheons, since saints are just ripped off Greek and Roman deities. Lol and not even they were original.ProfX wrote: ↑Sat Aug 06, 2022 6:36 pm https://www.americamagazine.org/arts-cu ... ll-jesuits
The true ordeal of the Teton Lakota, the warrior tribe that whipped the U.S. Cavalry in several notable fights in the 1870s, began after the shooting stopped. Worse than the persistent hunger was the federal effort to “civilize” the Indians by stages into hat- and trouser-wearing farmers with one wife, Christian first names, fixed last names and children who learned English in school. But the authorities had one aim above all others—to end the ancient practice of smoking a traditional pipe with a mixture of tobacco and the inner bark of the red willow before calling out to the ultimate power behind all things addressed by Lakota as Tunkashila. The Lakota resisted all of these changes but clung to nothing more tenaciously than the pipe.
The Oglala holy man and healer known as Black Elk once said that Lakota used tunkashila, which means grandfather, as a sign of respect and intimacy. The word, with the accent on the second syllable, is not the name of God, who has no name in traditional Lakota religion but is simply described as Wakan Tanka, translated by convention into English as Great Spirit. But wakan is a heavily freighted word. It means spirit in the sense of immaterial, large, eternal and everywhere, but it also means ancient, unknowable, mysterious and powerful.
The Lakota wakan tanka in some particulars resembles the traditional Judeo-Christian-Muslim god—knows everything, is the source of everything, can be reached by prayer—but was held in suspicion by the Christian churches that established themselves on the Lakota reservations in South Dakota. To defend the primacy of the Bible the churches persuaded the federal authorities by the early 1880s to impose a Code of Indian Offenses with reservation courts to try, convict and punish offenses that were all religious or cultural in nature. Outlawed for the next 50 years were the sun dance, traditional medicine, use of a sweat lodge for purification, plural marriages and dispersal of personal property at death in a ceremony known as a giveaway. Officials intended to extinguish every aspect of Indian culture root and branch, starting with native languages.
Both witness and victim of this long ordeal was the Oglala Black Elk, who took the Christian name of Nicholas, became a Catholic in about 1904 and served as a catechist until 1930, when his life took a dramatic turn recorded by Joe Jackson in a book that is not only an exhaustive biography but the best account we have of what it meant for Northern Plains Indians to watch their children stripped of everything their fathers had believed. Both sides of this story are included—the religion Black Elk tried to preserve, and the battle for his allegiance waged by Jesuit priests who felt betrayed by his late-life return to the old ways.
The struggle began in 1930 when Black Elk at 67, fearing that traditional pipe religion would die with him, elected to tell the Nebraska poet John Neihardt about the central religious experience of his life—an elaborate vision he had experienced when he was 9 years old. Neihardt devoted the longest chapter of his book, Black Elk Speaks, to this vision, which has poetic splendor but is not easily summarized. At the heart of it is an account of the religious crisis faced by the Lakota people and of the charge placed upon Black Elk personally by the Six Grandfathers to restore the sacred hoop of life and the flowering tree at its center. Black Elk described all of it in a non-stop, three-week interview with Neihardt. Just as remarkable was Neihardt’s effort to record the vision faithfully.
When Black Elk Speaks was published in 1932 the holy man’s vision was the big central thing, followed by a more conventional account of his role in the major episodes of Oglala Lakota history, from his birth in 1863 through the massacre known as Wounded Knee in 1890. New to the story is Jackson’s account of Black Elk’s season with Buffalo Bill’s Wild West show in Europe 1887. After missing the boat home, he lived in France for a year, falling in love and fathering a child.
[snip]
But more important than placing Black Elk is what he managed to save. The vision he described for Neihardt, and later amplified for another scholar who came to his door, Joseph Epes Brown, preserves a clear account of a body of religious thinking that officials wanted to scrub from Lakota memory. The old-time Lakota always believed that it was the warriors who would save them. What Black Elk taught his people was to depend instead on something harder to take away than guns, the trust that prayers in their own language, delivered in their own way, would reach the god they addressed as Tunkashila.
[snip][end]
In a country that claims to value religious freedom, it tried to exterminate the Lakota religion.
Dunno what problem this guy has with Black Elk, but he tried to preserve it before the washichu destroyed it.
Yes, Black Elk was nominally a Catholic, but continued to practice his traditional Native faith at the same time. That's a familiar story to me, reminds me of Cuban "Catholics" who still practice Santeria, or Haitian ones who practice Voudoun.
________________________________
The way to right wrongs is to
Shine the light of truth on them.
~ Ida B. Wells
________________________________
The way to right wrongs is to
Shine the light of truth on them.
~ Ida B. Wells
________________________________
-
carmenjonze
- Posts: 9614
- Joined: Mon Oct 25, 2021 3:06 am
Re: Pine Ridge Rez Restricts Xian Missionaries
It's too bad that a lot of Protestants are still freaked out about the pagan deity -> Christian saint trajectory. Plenty of Protestant denominations have kept many of the major Catholic saints, and hey, why shouldn't they, if they want.
Then along comes Marvel. lol
Then along comes Marvel. lol
________________________________
The way to right wrongs is to
Shine the light of truth on them.
~ Ida B. Wells
________________________________
The way to right wrongs is to
Shine the light of truth on them.
~ Ida B. Wells
________________________________
Re: Pine Ridge Rez Restricts Xian Missionaries
The Devil of Hell's Kitchen
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6TvfZ2XZgVE
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6TvfZ2XZgVE
"Don't believe every quote attributed to people on the Internet" -- Abraham Lincoln
Re: Pine Ridge Rez Restricts Xian Missionaries
carmenjonze wrote: ↑Sat Aug 06, 2022 9:25 pm It's too bad that a lot of Protestants are still freaked out about the pagan deity -> Christian saint trajectory. Plenty of Protestant denominations have kept many of the major Catholic saints, and hey, why shouldn't they, if they want.
Then along comes Marvel. lol
Exactly every person should have tug he right to recognize and worship or not recognize or worship the diety as they see fit.
https://bible.knowing-jesus.com/topics/ ... eartedness
This link has about 5 brief passages of scripture. They all say the Lord your God.
By using the word s Your God wouldn't that indicate that there is more than one way to worship God and that we are all free to do so in.our own manner.
" I am a socialist " Bernie Sanders
Re: Pine Ridge Rez Restricts Xian Missionaries
I'm not interested in discussing scripture.
I am interested in pointing out the Constitution has a free exercise clause.
Free exercise of all religions either means what it claims ... or it doesn't.
There is no asterisk that limits that exercise to only people who read the Bible, or practice Abrahamic faiths.
And so there never should have been a government-backed campaign to get the Lakota to abandon their traditional, tribal, animistic/henotheistic religion. But there was.
I am interested in pointing out the Constitution has a free exercise clause.
Free exercise of all religions either means what it claims ... or it doesn't.
There is no asterisk that limits that exercise to only people who read the Bible, or practice Abrahamic faiths.
And so there never should have been a government-backed campaign to get the Lakota to abandon their traditional, tribal, animistic/henotheistic religion. But there was.
"Don't believe every quote attributed to people on the Internet" -- Abraham Lincoln
Re: Pine Ridge Rez Restricts Xian Missionaries
Religion, sigh.
Ya know when Reagan fantasized about a UFO landing and aliens confronting the human race, what he really was saying in his very limited, low IQ way was "ya know there really is no god, per se, and if we were all confronted with it maybe MAYBE we could cut out a lot of this kill or be killed shit."
Ya know when Reagan fantasized about a UFO landing and aliens confronting the human race, what he really was saying in his very limited, low IQ way was "ya know there really is no god, per se, and if we were all confronted with it maybe MAYBE we could cut out a lot of this kill or be killed shit."
I sigh in your general direction.
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carmenjonze
- Posts: 9614
- Joined: Mon Oct 25, 2021 3:06 am
Re: Pine Ridge Rez Restricts Xian Missionaries
This Knowing-Jesus site you linked does not AT ALL accept this idea. It is a Biblical Inerrancy, premillennial Dispensationalist proselytizing site. It is their way or the highway, and they state this right in their long, rambling, self-important doctrinal statement. :problem:Glennfs wrote: ↑Sun Aug 07, 2022 1:18 pm Exactly every person should have tug he right to recognize and worship or not recognize or worship the diety as they see fit.
https://bible.knowing-jesus.com/topics/ ... eartedness
This link has about 5 brief passages of scripture. They all say the Lord your God.
By using the word s Your God wouldn't that indicate that there is more than one way to worship God and that we are all free to do so in.our own manner.
As you know, I’m not interested AT ALL in theological arguments, especially bigoted, Fundagelical theologies like Knowing-Jesus.com.
I am very interested, however, in protecting myself from these types of bigots, because they’re the loudest ones clamoring to force me and everyone I know into second-class citizenship.
People like this are the reason people detest Christianity and religion in general. Hard to blame those who do. These people are VICIOUS.
Last edited by carmenjonze on Sun Aug 07, 2022 4:20 pm, edited 1 time in total.
________________________________
The way to right wrongs is to
Shine the light of truth on them.
~ Ida B. Wells
________________________________
The way to right wrongs is to
Shine the light of truth on them.
~ Ida B. Wells
________________________________
Re: Pine Ridge Rez Restricts Xian Missionaries
Con links to disgusting site promoting hatred, what's new...
I sigh in your general direction.
Re: Pine Ridge Rez Restricts Xian Missionaries
IMHO, the effort of trying to suppress Native religion was just one part of a larger effort to suppress their culture, as carried out through the boarding schools here (and in Canada). Other parts of it included forcing Native people to abandon their traditional ways of dress (and wearing their hair), their languages, and many other aspects of their culture and way of life. It was a program of forced assimilation, ironic, of course, as they lived here first.
Culture and religion are hard to separate. This is an argument I've pointed to many times. I too am not interested in theological arguments over scripture; this ain't the place for them. However, this country had no right to take an axe to the Native cultures of people like the Lakota, and sadly, a number of churches (Mormon included) gladly participated in this culturicide carried out by the government.
I first read Black Elk Speaks when I was in college. It's an amazing work, and he seemed like an amazing man. I guess it gets my goat that this a-hole thinks in the name of Jeeeezus he can lie about him. Good the Pine Ridge council sent him packing.
Culture and religion are hard to separate. This is an argument I've pointed to many times. I too am not interested in theological arguments over scripture; this ain't the place for them. However, this country had no right to take an axe to the Native cultures of people like the Lakota, and sadly, a number of churches (Mormon included) gladly participated in this culturicide carried out by the government.
I first read Black Elk Speaks when I was in college. It's an amazing work, and he seemed like an amazing man. I guess it gets my goat that this a-hole thinks in the name of Jeeeezus he can lie about him. Good the Pine Ridge council sent him packing.
"Don't believe every quote attributed to people on the Internet" -- Abraham Lincoln
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carmenjonze
- Posts: 9614
- Joined: Mon Oct 25, 2021 3:06 am
Re: Pine Ridge Rez Restricts Xian Missionaries
His argument is in support of the colonizer god being forced onto people who already have their own traditions.
Basic white supremacism with a veneer of theology. It’s really about using government force to eliminate everyone in their way.
________________________________
The way to right wrongs is to
Shine the light of truth on them.
~ Ida B. Wells
________________________________
The way to right wrongs is to
Shine the light of truth on them.
~ Ida B. Wells
________________________________
Re: Pine Ridge Rez Restricts Xian Missionaries
Silent Warrior - the Cross of Change (Enigma)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8GFHvLnDeVE
White men came in the name of god
They took their land, they took their lives
A new age has just begun
.
They lost their gods, they lost their smile
They cried for help for the last time.
Liberty was turning into chains
But all the white men said
That's the cross of changes
.
In the name of God - the fight for gold
These were the changes.
Tell me - is it right - in the name of god
These kind of changes ?
.
They tried to fight for liberty
Without a chance in hell, they gave up.
White men won in the name of god
With the cross as alibi
.
There's no God who ever tried
To change the world in this way.
For the ones who abuse his name
There'll be no chance to escape
On judgment day
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8GFHvLnDeVE
White men came in the name of god
They took their land, they took their lives
A new age has just begun
.
They lost their gods, they lost their smile
They cried for help for the last time.
Liberty was turning into chains
But all the white men said
That's the cross of changes
.
In the name of God - the fight for gold
These were the changes.
Tell me - is it right - in the name of god
These kind of changes ?
.
They tried to fight for liberty
Without a chance in hell, they gave up.
White men won in the name of god
With the cross as alibi
.
There's no God who ever tried
To change the world in this way.
For the ones who abuse his name
There'll be no chance to escape
On judgment day
"Don't believe every quote attributed to people on the Internet" -- Abraham Lincoln