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PostPosted: Thu May 25, 2017 3:23 pm 
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NO doubt at all that our military kills innocents.

I am against drones and I am pretty much against most war, or all but I do have a question, WHAT do you do about Taliban and ISIL who will kill every single one of us if they can?

What would the Saudi's and their allies do to Israel if we werent around and Israel had no nukes?

Yes there a many questions concerning civilian casualties. Wars itself has become an epidemic. But tactics are becoming a large question. "If" the ratio of civilian casualties were low then so would the concern. So, what is the ratio?

If you believe Obama's official report, (which is obscenely laughable) I will let you decide:
Quote:
The Obama administration estimated in June 2016 that US drone strikes under Obama had killed 64 individuals conclusively determined to be non-combatants, in addition to 52 individuals whose status remained in doubt.[8]


...

Quote:
Former U.S. President Jimmy Carter has criticized such use of UAVs: "We don't know how many hundreds of innocent civilians have been killed in these attacks ... This would have been unthinkable in previous times."[14]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Civilian_ ... ne_strikes

I agree with Carter's sentiment.

For those who don't know what to think, these figures from Daniel L. Byman of the Brookings Institution are the most reliable:
Quote:
drone strikes may kill "10 or so civilians" for every militant killed, which would represent a civilian to combatant casualty ratio of 10:1.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Civilian_casualty_ratio

and
Quote:
According to a new report from The Intercept, nearly 90 percent of people killed in recent drone strikes in Afghanistan “were not the intended targets” of the attacks.

Documents detailing a special operations campaign in northeastern Afghanistan, Operation Haymaker, show that between January 2012 and February 2013, U.S. special operations airstrikes killed more than 200 people. Of those, only 35 were the intended targets. During one five-month period of the operation, according to the documents, nearly 90 percent of the people killed in airstrikes were not the intended targets. In Yemen and Somalia, where the U.S. has far more limited intelligence capabilities to confirm the people killed are the intended targets, the equivalent ratios may well be much worse.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/civ ... dd7ea6c4ff

How about a mixed metaphor: Use a carrot instead of a stick. There is a lot more we can do to avoid military conflict. Stopping wars are a priority. Secondly, the real facts reveal that the military needs more accountability for humanitarian violations. Excuses that oops, the civilians got in the way is not acceptable. Bombing is indiscriminate and precision bombs don't exist. Hiding the facts about casualties is not acceptable...don't you think?

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PostPosted: Thu May 25, 2017 7:22 pm 
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I cant tell if you included this story or not
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2017/ ... -iraq-2003


Quote:
US admits Mosul airstrikes killed over 100 civilians during battle with Isis
The Pentagon says airstrikes it carried out on a house were the deadliest in Iraq since 2003, and the final death toll could be as high as 141 people


This is the escalation of war that trump is making happen.

World war might be any day now.

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PostPosted: Fri May 26, 2017 1:29 pm 
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World wars use data now.

Guns and bombs are for the regional ones.

> Military Industrial Complex

Military Industrial Academic Complex.

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PostPosted: Fri May 26, 2017 3:41 pm 
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World wars use data now.

Guns and bombs are for the regional ones.

> Military Industrial Complex

Military Industrial Academic Complex.

Yup. I mentioned a book to the good professor a while ago called "Weaponizing Anthropology" by David Price iirc.

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bird's theorem-"we the people" are stupid.

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The new motto of the USA: Unum de multis. Out of one, many.


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PostPosted: Fri May 26, 2017 3:57 pm 
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DARPA funds a lot of research, and somebody's getting those grants. The thing is, unlike other research grants, because many of those projects are classified, the researchers not only can't get peer review from other colleagues, they can't even talk about what they're working on. The Applied Physics Lab at my alma mater did a lot of research on (for example) missile guidance systems.

As I said, I met David Price. I've seen him talk about this topic in person. The main focus of the book is during the 60s and 70s, when anthropologists would get DoD grants as part of Project Camelot/Phoenix, and would then study peasant societies in Vietnam - or Latin America. But that data was going to the Pentagon and being used in counterinsurgency warfare and tactics.

It's for exactly that reason the American Anthropological Association developed their Code of Ethics, the prime directive being "do no harm" to informants, including giving their location to the Pentagon so it can more effectively find and kill them.

This has not stopped.

Anthropologists working in other countries are routinely accused of working for the CIA or DoD. And the worst problem is, a small handful, actually are, making it harder for the others to be trusted and do their work. Price, of course, argues anybody getting DoD funding should admit it up front. He does say if you're going to take those grants, admit it to your university, other funders, and most importantly, the people you are working with. "Informed consent".

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PostPosted: Tue May 30, 2017 3:38 pm 
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Report: U.S.-Led Airstrikes in Syria Kill 100+ Civilians, Including 47 Children

Quote:
In Syria, a monitoring group says U.S.-led airstrikes killed more than 100 civilians—including 47 children—on Thursday and Friday in the ISIS-held town of Al Mayadeen in eastern Syria. The Syrian Observatory for Human Rights says the two rounds of strikes targeted the families of ISIS fighters and that the vast majority of the victims were civilian women and their children. The U.S.-led coalition has acknowledged launching the airstrikes on the town.

https://www.democracynow.org/2017/5/30/headlines

How are the hawks going to spin this? Can they actually say that over a hundred people were actually overlooked? Or, if the press presses them (not likely), they will tell us that Syria does it too.

As I have been saying, who is going to take responsibility?

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PostPosted: Tue May 30, 2017 5:01 pm 
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I've been to an SOA protest. There were a few dozen people there.


Ask 100 Americans if they know what the School of the Americas is/was and 99 of them will either stare at you blankly, or suggest it's a Christian college in South Carolina. And I agree that no graduate is likely to have directly caused the death of any American. Indirectly...maybe a bunch.

Personally, whenever the subject of the SOA comes up, my mind automatically goes to thoughts about "Blowtorch Bob."

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PostPosted: Fri Oct 26, 2018 10:34 pm 
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Quote:
..........“The big countries say they are fighting each other in Yemen,” Mr. Hajaji said. “But it feels to us like they are fighting the poor people.”.............



THE TRAGEDY OF SAUDI ARABIA’S WAR

Quote:
CHEST HEAVING AND EYES FLUTTERING, the 3-year-old boy lay silently on a hospital bed in the highland town of Hajjah, a bag of bones fighting for breath.

His father, Ali al-Hajaji, stood anxiously over him. Mr. Hajaji had already lost one son three weeks earlier to the epidemic of hunger sweeping across Yemen. Now he feared that a second was slipping away.

It wasn’t for a lack of food in the area: The stores outside the hospital gate were filled with goods and the markets were bustling. But Mr. Hajaji couldn’t afford any of it because prices were rising too fast.

“I can barely buy a piece of stale bread,” he said. “That’s why my children are dying before my eyes.”.............


A love so great for starvation they put all their resources towards achieving it.

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PostPosted: Fri Nov 02, 2018 12:36 am 
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Yemen Girl Who Turned World’s Eyes to Famine Is Dead

Quote:
A haunted look in the eyes of Amal Hussain, an emaciated 7-year-old lying silently on a hospital bed in northern Yemen, seemed to sum up the dire circumstances of her war-torn country.

A searing portrait of the starving girl published in The New York Times last week drew an impassioned response from readers. They expressed heartbreak. They offered money for her family. They wrote in to ask if she was getting better.

On Thursday, Amal’s family said she had died at a ragged refugee camp four miles from the hospital.

“My heart is broken,” said her mother, Mariam Ali, who wept during a phone interview. “Amal was always smiling. Now I’m worried for my other children.”............


Quote:
Amal is Arabic for “hope,”

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PostPosted: Sun Nov 11, 2018 4:37 pm 
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US stops refuelling of Saudi-led coalition aircraft in Yemen war

Quote:
........A coordinated decision by Washington and Riyadh to halt the refuelling could be an attempt by both countries to forestall further action by Congress.......


We Must Stop Helping Saudi Arabia in Yemen

Quote:
Congress needs to step in to end our complicity in the kingdom’s human rights abuses.


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PostPosted: Wed Feb 06, 2019 12:34 am 
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US general shows Saudi coalition support after weapons report

Quote:
The top United States military commander in the Middle East suggested Tuesday that America would continue to back its allies waging war in Yemen, despite new evidence of arms deal violations uncovered by a CNN investigation.

Gen. Joseph Votel, the head of Central Command (CENTCOM), told a Senate hearing on Tuesday that withdrawing US support for the Saudi-led coalition in Yemen would remove the "leverage we have to continue to influence them"...............

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PostPosted: Wed Feb 06, 2019 1:51 pm 
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Petroleum politics.

Apparently cutting up journalists (while still alive) is also OK.

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PostPosted: Wed Feb 06, 2019 3:51 pm 
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Ask 100 Americans if they know what the School of the Americas is/was and 99 of them will either stare at you blankly, or suggest it's a Christian college in South Carolina. And I agree that no graduate is likely to have directly caused the death of any American. Indirectly...maybe a bunch.

Personally, whenever the subject of the SOA comes up, my mind automatically goes to thoughts about "Blowtorch Bob."

Really? My mind goes to Ronald Reagan. They scrubbed the name too. It is...drum roll, please...

Western Hemispere Institue for Security Cooperation (WHINSEC).

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/School_ ... icas_Watch

They get a minimum of 8 hours of human rights train8ng and the concept of civilian control of the military. There, it’s all better now.

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bird's theorem-"we the people" are stupid.

"No one is so foolish as to choose war over peace. In peace sons bury their fathers, in war fathers bury their sons." - Herodotus

The new motto of the USA: Unum de multis. Out of one, many.


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PostPosted: Thu Feb 14, 2019 2:03 am 
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House passes anti-Yemen war resolution

Quote:
The House adopted a resolution Wednesday calling for the end of any US military support for the Saudi-led war in Yemen, which was deemed the world's worst humanitarian crisis last year by the United Nations.

The measure passed 248-177, with one voting present.

The resolution directs the President to remove any US armed forces that are affecting the war with Yemen, with the exception of forces fighting Al Qaeda on the Arabian Peninsula, in less than 30 days after the resolution is enacted...............

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