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PostPosted: Fri Sep 13, 2019 6:52 pm 
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Easy for you to say the race or ethnicity doesn't matter.


I was only referring to the situation of that child's (PR/US) nationality... in the present.

BTW, from about 1790 to the 1950s/60s, race and ethnicity definitely DID have a lot to do (formally) with U.S. nationality and naturalization (see: Naturalization Act of 1790), but that finally changed in 1965.

These things matter because people make them matter ... but we've had that discussion.

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PostPosted: Fri Sep 13, 2019 6:57 pm 
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Well, there was Juan Epstein from Welcome Back Kotter, but he was a fictional character.

Image

Many Puerto Ricans could have Marrano or Converso (Sephardi) ancestry, even if at present they don't identify as Jewish. (See: AOC).


See...this just ads to my confusion. I expect a Puerto Rican guy to have a name like Geraldo Rivera, not Geraldo Shapiro. Although O'keeffe's later in life companion was Juan Hamilton. I think his parents just liked the name Juan.

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I never said you were a racist Ike.

BUT YOU'RE NOT RACIST....EXCEPT WHEN YOU ARE.


Last edited by Ike Bana on Fri Sep 13, 2019 6:59 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Fri Sep 13, 2019 6:58 pm 
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Easy for you to say the race or ethnicity doesn't matter.The longer I live, the more race and ethnicity matters, almost by the hour. Shit...I remember when we were hippie kids making our parents insane having sex with each other and shouting st the top of our lungs that race doesn't matter...ethnicity doesn't matter


It obviously mattered then, too, because we see that attitudes of many from your generation and older, yourself included, are no different than they were prior to the 70s. It's why every white demographic voted majority-Trump.

Having sex with people said to be different from you isn't proof of gender, race, ethnicity, etc, not mattering; it's often far from it. In fact, I've learned after the fact with a couple exes that they were with me because they had something to prove about their attitudes towards such things. It's not some noble act of revolutionary rebellion in itself.

We're only one generation away from said sex having been illegal as a matter of law and public policy and the attitudes behind it still persist. So yes it definitely matters, now that we have a(nother) wn president with clearly biased polices based on national origin and religion.

But this comment is an attempt to move the goalposts, anyway. As far as the birthright citizenship your quesion references, the kid is an American citizen.

Hopefully this theoretical couple is not in the military, as you may remember this post USCIS: Another con ploy against birthright citizenship, this new policy that makes military parents who have a kid in a territory jump through extra hoops for the kid to be an American citizen.


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...even gender doesnt matter even for those of us locked into the binary gender model...


You misunderstand the gender, gender binary, and sexuality, almost completely. Sexuality and gender are not the same thing or interchangeable.

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Just sharing my confusion about what matters is bound to piss somebody off.


The only person around here likely to get pissed off about this topic is you, but there's hope: you don't have go around confused all day. Self-education is a virtue.

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I've never said this about glen accurately pointing out your racism before, and I defy you to post a link to any post where I have.

With this race baiting comment outta carmen, I feel I owe the guy [glen] an apology.


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PostPosted: Fri Sep 13, 2019 7:10 pm 
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I expect a Puerto Rican guy to have a name like Geraldo Rivera, not Geraldo Shapiro.


Why?

People anglicize their names when they immigrate here, why would they not Latinize their names in PR or Cuba or Brazil, Mexico, etc.?

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I've never said this about glen accurately pointing out your racism before, and I defy you to post a link to any post where I have.

With this race baiting comment outta carmen, I feel I owe the guy [glen] an apology.


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PostPosted: Fri Sep 13, 2019 7:26 pm 
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One of Ike Bana's 10 rotated, repeated quotes is from that Tom Lehrer song. But in the Caribbean, so it would seem, everybody hates the Haitians. Oh and so does our own country when conservative whites are in charge. (They never got over that revolution & independence from like 215 years ago. And since ProfX mentioned the Naturalization Act, the Haitian revolution is one impetus behind the Alien and Sedition Acts. :problem: )

Stigma of being Haitian in the Bahamas reignites after Hurricane Dorian - Sun-Sentinel

Quote:
Quetelie Decius doesn’t feel welcome in Nassau where she disembarked from a mailboat that delivered her from the living hell of Marsh Harbour after dark on Saturday with no destination.

Nor does she feel safe, or secure, in the high-crime city with her three children, ages 5, 8 and 12.

“I don’t feel good. I don’t feel comfortable,” Decius said, a broken, faraway look in her eye, total exhaustion on her face.

Her daughter and two sons look at her, wondering what they’re going to do, where they’re going to go, she said. “It’s killing me.”

Decius is Haitian.


More in link.

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I've never said this about glen accurately pointing out your racism before, and I defy you to post a link to any post where I have.

With this race baiting comment outta carmen, I feel I owe the guy [glen] an apology.


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PostPosted: Fri Sep 13, 2019 10:07 pm 
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From the Kids Today... Department:

Try suggesting that race, ethnicity, and the proper attitudes about gender don't matter these days.


This is a resentful rightwing, FOMO canard.

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I've never said this about glen accurately pointing out your racism before, and I defy you to post a link to any post where I have.

With this race baiting comment outta carmen, I feel I owe the guy [glen] an apology.


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PostPosted: Sat Sep 14, 2019 1:31 pm 
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Jew baby?


Yeah that's right...Jew baby. Speaking of Jew babies...there was this trainer in the Negro leagues, Frank "Jewbaby" Floyd. Nobody knew why he was called "Jewbaby". Buck O'Neill once said, "Don't know why we called him Jewbaby, he was black as me."

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I never said you were a racist Ike.

BUT YOU'RE NOT RACIST....EXCEPT WHEN YOU ARE.


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PostPosted: Sat Sep 14, 2019 1:54 pm 
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> They never got over that revolution & independence from like 215 years ago.

Nope. How dare the slaves rebel like the Jacobins et al in France? What, they think they're people too, or something? What if OUR slaves find out and get uppity? Haiti was always the bad guys. The residue persists in poor economics due to deforestation, corruption, and the legacy of huge reparations demanded by France.

Similarly, we all know why suddenly Bahamians don't have the same rights to enter the US.

They're mostly African diaspora.

Q.E.D..

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PostPosted: Sat Sep 14, 2019 2:11 pm 
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From the Kids Today... Department:



This is a resentful rightwing, FOMO canard.


Maybe in your communities.

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I never said you were a racist Ike.

BUT YOU'RE NOT RACIST....EXCEPT WHEN YOU ARE.


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PostPosted: Sat Sep 14, 2019 2:54 pm 
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Maybe in your communities.


We belong to several of the same communities.

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I've never said this about glen accurately pointing out your racism before, and I defy you to post a link to any post where I have.

With this race baiting comment outta carmen, I feel I owe the guy [glen] an apology.


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PostPosted: Sat Sep 14, 2019 2:55 pm 
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Yeah that's right...Jew baby. Speaking of Jew babies...there was this trainer in the Negro leagues, Frank "Jewbaby" Floyd. Nobody knew why he was called "Jewbaby". Buck O'Neill once said, "Don't know why we called him Jewbaby, he was black as me."


Source?

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I've never said this about glen accurately pointing out your racism before, and I defy you to post a link to any post where I have.

With this race baiting comment outta carmen, I feel I owe the guy [glen] an apology.


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PostPosted: Sat Sep 14, 2019 3:19 pm 
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This is him. He was the trainer for the Kansas City Monarchs. He treated Satchel Paige.

Image

Of course, there are no more "Negro Leagues" anymore.

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PostPosted: Sat Sep 14, 2019 3:22 pm 
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"Geraldo Rivera"

[from Wiki]
Rivera was born at Beth Israel Medical Center in New York City, New York, the son of Lillian (née Friedman; October 16, 1919 – June 3, 2018) and Cruz "Allen" Rivera (October 1, 1915 – November 1987), a restaurant worker and cab driver respectively.[3][4] Rivera's father was a Puerto Rican Catholic,[5] and his mother was of Russian Jewish descent. He was raised "mostly Jewish" and had a Bar Mitzvah ceremony.[6][7] He grew up in Brooklyn and West Babylon, New York, where he attended West Babylon High School. Rivera's family was sometimes subjected to prejudice and racism, and his mother took to spelling their surname as "Riviera" to avoid having bigotry directed at them (and only his sister Sharon did not have her surname misspelled.).[8][9]

When I was born, my mother filled in my birth certificate with the name Gerald Riviera, adding an extra "i" to my father's surname. She did the same thing for my sister Irene. Later, she would drop the pretense for my sister Sharon, only to pick it up again with the birth of my baby brother Craig. Whenever we asked about the inconsistencies, she would shrug shyly and joke her way out of it. "I just forgot how to spell it," she would say, and leave it at that. Underneath, I came to realize, she was deeply embarrassed over what was a clumsy attempt at an ethnic cover-up.

[snip]

After working with such organizations as the lower Manhattan-based Community Action for Legal Services and the National Lawyers Guild, Rivera became a frequent attorney for the Puerto Rican activist group, the Young Lords, eventually precipitating his entry into private practice.[13][14] This work attracted the attention of WABC-TV news director Al Primo when Rivera was interviewed about the group's occupation of an East Harlem church in 1969. Primo offered Rivera a job as a reporter but was unhappy with the first name "Gerald" (he wanted something more identifiably Latino) so they agreed to go with the pronunciation used by the Puerto Rican side of Rivera's family: Geraldo.[15]

[snip][end]

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PostPosted: Sat Sep 14, 2019 4:37 pm 
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This is him. He was the trainer for the Kansas City Monarchs. He treated Satchel Paige.

Image



Yes I'm wondering the source for the quote.

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I've never said this about glen accurately pointing out your racism before, and I defy you to post a link to any post where I have.

With this race baiting comment outta carmen, I feel I owe the guy [glen] an apology.


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PostPosted: Sat Sep 14, 2019 4:46 pm 
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"Geraldo Rivera"

[from Wiki]
Rivera was born at Beth Israel Medical Center in New York City, New York, the son of Lillian (née Friedman; October 16, 1919 – June 3, 2018) and Cruz "Allen" Rivera (October 1, 1915 – November 1987), a restaurant worker and cab driver respectively.[3][4] Rivera's father was a Puerto Rican Catholic,[5] and his mother was of Russian Jewish descent. He was raised "mostly Jewish" and had a Bar Mitzvah ceremony.[6][7] He grew up in Brooklyn and West Babylon, New York, where he attended West Babylon High School. Rivera's family was sometimes subjected to prejudice and racism, and his mother took to spelling their surname as "Riviera" to avoid having bigotry directed at them (and only his sister Sharon did not have her surname misspelled.).[8][9]

When I was born, my mother filled in my birth certificate with the name Gerald Riviera, adding an extra "i" to my father's surname. She did the same thing for my sister Irene. Later, she would drop the pretense for my sister Sharon, only to pick it up again with the birth of my baby brother Craig. Whenever we asked about the inconsistencies, she would shrug shyly and joke her way out of it. "I just forgot how to spell it," she would say, and leave it at that. Underneath, I came to realize, she was deeply embarrassed over what was a clumsy attempt at an ethnic cover-up.

[snip]

After working with such organizations as the lower Manhattan-based Community Action for Legal Services and the National Lawyers Guild, Rivera became a frequent attorney for the Puerto Rican activist group, the Young Lords, eventually precipitating his entry into private practice.[13][14] This work attracted the attention of WABC-TV news director Al Primo when Rivera was interviewed about the group's occupation of an East Harlem church in 1969. Primo offered Rivera a job as a reporter but was unhappy with the first name "Gerald" (he wanted something more identifiably Latino) so they agreed to go with the pronunciation used by the Puerto Rican side of Rivera's family: Geraldo.[15]

[snip][end]


Ah somehow I thought he was from PR. And re: this part

Quote:
After working with such organizations as the lower Manhattan-based Community Action for Legal Services and the National Lawyers Guild, Rivera became a frequent attorney for the Puerto Rican activist group, the Young Lords, eventually precipitating his entry into private practice.[13][14] This work attracted the attention of WABC-TV news director Al Primo when Rivera was interviewed about the group's occupation of an East Harlem church in 1969.


there is a 50 year anniversary project about the Young Lords going on in NYC now. Didn't know he had been one of their lawyers.

https://younglordsny.org/

https://www.mappingresistance.com/ - I would LOVE to take their walking tour!

Sylvia Rivera, one of the women (who was trans) that kicked off the Stonewall Rebellion had also been a Young Lord.

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I've never said this about glen accurately pointing out your racism before, and I defy you to post a link to any post where I have.

With this race baiting comment outta carmen, I feel I owe the guy [glen] an apology.


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PostPosted: Sat Sep 14, 2019 5:11 pm 
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Source?


Oh...did I make the whole thing up, just to fuck with you?

Source is Buck O'Neil* you arrogant ass.


*Source spelling correction courtesy of Ken Burns.

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I never said you were a racist Ike.

BUT YOU'RE NOT RACIST....EXCEPT WHEN YOU ARE.


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PostPosted: Sat Sep 14, 2019 5:17 pm 
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Source is Buck O'Neil* you arrogant ass.


:lol:

You might have noticed this by now but maybe not: everybody here sources their quotes. Do you think you're special?

Link?

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I've never said this about glen accurately pointing out your racism before, and I defy you to post a link to any post where I have.

With this race baiting comment outta carmen, I feel I owe the guy [glen] an apology.


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PostPosted: Sat Sep 14, 2019 5:19 pm 
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Oh...did I make the whole thing up, just to fuck with you?

Source is Buck O'Neil* you arrogant ass.


*Source spelling correction courtesy of Ken Burns.

When you call a wonderful person like CJ any name, let alone "arrogant ass", you do realize no decent person will give you a SHRED of credibility ever again, right?

Dont bother answering, you arrogant ass!

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"Corporate Democrat" phrase created at the same place "Angry Mob" was...People keep falling for rightwing talking points. How sad.


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PostPosted: Sat Sep 14, 2019 5:32 pm 
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When you call a wonderful person like CJ any name, let alone "arrogant ass", you do realize no decent person will give you a SHRED of credibility ever again, right?


Ike Bana is a violent, authoritarian misogynist and most of those guys are self-hating cowards with massive entitlement issues. Classic incels of the type that shoot up schools and malls because some woman said no to them.

Lol EVERYONE who disagrees with him on some point big or small gets labeled "arrogant". Soon you will, too, if you haven't been already.

Wonder if he thinks "arrogant" is a DSM diagnosis like he does "hysteria". :lol: :problem:

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I've never said this about glen accurately pointing out your racism before, and I defy you to post a link to any post where I have.

With this race baiting comment outta carmen, I feel I owe the guy [glen] an apology.


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PostPosted: Sat Sep 14, 2019 5:38 pm 
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When you call a wonderful person like CJ any name, let alone "arrogant ass", you do realize no decent person will give you a SHRED of credibility ever again, right?

Dont bother answering, you arrogant ass!


Off your meds again, eh?

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I never said you were a racist Ike.

BUT YOU'RE NOT RACIST....EXCEPT WHEN YOU ARE.


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PostPosted: Sat Sep 14, 2019 5:39 pm 
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So here's a funny thing. While I still can't find where the nickname came from, it seems to have been common in the Negro Leagues.

George Clifford “Jew Baby” Bennette
https://www.findagrave.com/memorial/141 ... d-bennette

Byron "Jew Baby" Johnson (aka "Mex")
https://history.denverlibrary.org/news/ ... -shortstop

For reasons I'd love to find out, it doesn't seem to have been an uncommon nickname in the Negro Leagues.

So there's this. I wonder.

Rabbi discusses role of Jews in Negro League Baseball
https://whyy.org/articles/baseball/

What Alpert found after she began her research was a complex web of interactions between African Americans and Jews in baseball that are now mostly forgotten

[snip][end]

Found the source of the quote, BTW.

https://www.greatblackheroes.com/sports/satchel-paige/
"He called the trainer. Our trainer was Jew-Baby Floyd — and I don’t know why they called him Jew-Baby, ’cause he was black as me — but anyway, when Jew-Baby comes out with his, you know, like the smock that the doctor would wear, and he’s got a concoction in a glass."
Buck O’Neil.

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PostPosted: Sat Sep 14, 2019 5:42 pm 
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Ike Bana is a violent, authoritarian misogynist and most of those guys are self-hating cowards with massive entitlement issues. Classic incels of the type that shoot up schools and malls because some woman said no to them.

Lol EVERYONE who disagrees with him on some point big or small gets labeled "arrogant". Soon you will, too, if you haven't been already.

Wonder if he thinks "arrogant" is a DSM diagnosis like he does "hysteria". :lol: :problem:

I wonder if he has a straight face on him when he accuses ME of needing meds when he is acting like such an out of control asshole?

Probably. What Ike still hasnt learned is I dont care what he says, or what anyone says who I do not respect.

I EXPECT the cons here to say shit to me, and when they are nicey nicey with the two here you know who then that tells me they have more in common than not.

Which we all have known for a while.

Hey, it is simple, either you loudly denounce the traitor racist piece of shit loudly and daily or you are endorsing him. And we know who here NEVER denounces him.

And for Sam and Ike, you are either on the side of justice and patriotism or you aint. Cant be nicey nicey with people who support a VILE VICIOUS MURDERING TRAITOR (putin) or his puppet.

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"Corporate Democrat" phrase created at the same place "Angry Mob" was...People keep falling for rightwing talking points. How sad.


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PostPosted: Sat Sep 14, 2019 5:43 pm 
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Off your meds again, eh?


You're the ONLY person here most likely to have a meltdown today, as you do every single day here. Do you have a meds regimen? If so I think you should get back on it.

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I've never said this about glen accurately pointing out your racism before, and I defy you to post a link to any post where I have.

With this race baiting comment outta carmen, I feel I owe the guy [glen] an apology.


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PostPosted: Sat Sep 14, 2019 5:46 pm 
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:lol:

You might have noticed this by now but maybe not: everybody here sources their quotes. Do you think you're special?

Link?


Ken Burns Baseball

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I never said you were a racist Ike.

BUT YOU'RE NOT RACIST....EXCEPT WHEN YOU ARE.


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PostPosted: Sat Sep 14, 2019 5:53 pm 
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I wonder if he has a straight face on him when he accuses ME of needing meds when he is acting like such an out of control asshole?

Probably. What Ike still hasnt learned is I dont care what he says, or what anyone says who I do not respect.

I EXPECT the cons here to say shit to me, and when they are nicey nicey with the two here you know who then that tells me they have more in common than not.

Which we all have known for a while.

Hey, it is simple, either you loudly denounce the traitor racist piece of shit loudly and daily or you are endorsing him. And we know who here NEVER denounces him.


Ike Bana should really be more careful because if it's anyone around here who would be tagged as a volatile civil threat due to so-called mental health issues just based on his RFL posts alone, it's him.

Who knows what's in his actual record as a career mental health service provider with eugenicist and misogynist attitudes. :problem:

TBF I don't want that to happen to him because I don't want that to happen to anybody. But it's been floated as a trial balloon by this neofascist administration and given what they are doing to immigrants and those perceived, I would not be surprised to see them try it.

Quote:
And for Sam and Ike, you are either on the side of justice and patriotism or you aint. Cant be nicey nicey with people who support a VILE VICIOUS MURDERING TRAITOR (putin) or his puppet.


Demands for civility are for the birds. You might enoy this article.

Eleven Theses on Civility - Social Text

Quote:
2. Civility is not care, but it pretends to be; civility is the affective shape of administrative violence. It is the velvet glove around the iron claw; it is the rationality of logistics. Civility discourse enforces a false equation between incivility and violence that works to mask everyday violence as a civic norm. The violence that is polite is thrice as damaging as the direct attack because it gaslights as it wounds. By contrast, a radical incivility makes space for the fullness of the presence of pain and anger, as well as a diversity of styles through which both pain and anger emerge to be heard as objections to the crisis ordinary. Far from giving in to individuation, radical incivility turns us from individual pain to structural analysis; it is a with-ness that turns us toward each other. In this sense we understand radical to be a term that undoes the arkhe of subjectivity.

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I've never said this about glen accurately pointing out your racism before, and I defy you to post a link to any post where I have.

With this race baiting comment outta carmen, I feel I owe the guy [glen] an apology.


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