The Yes 4 Minneapolis charter amendment, explained

News and events of the day
User avatar
carmenjonze
Posts: 9614
Joined: Mon Oct 25, 2021 3:06 am

Re: The Yes 4 Minneapolis charter amendment, explained

Post by carmenjonze »

bradman wrote: Wed Dec 01, 2021 6:30 pm [bold]And that's what they couldn't prove in Yanez's case.

And yes, i get your final point. He was a cop and we should expect more from a cop. i would have been fine with manslaughter.
Not good enough.

Good enough for conservative white males like you who will never have to face down these people, perhaps.

Good enough for you supremacist dumbbells to tell the rest of us what is good enough for us. :problem:
we should expect more from a cop
That word, again.

Funny how when we expect even the bare human-rights minimum from cops, you get angry and nervous and look to your messiah Kyle Rittenhouse the nigger-lover killer from whence cometh your help.
________________________________

The way to right wrongs is to
Shine the light of truth on them.

~ Ida B. Wells
________________________________
gounion
Posts: 17051
Joined: Sun Oct 24, 2021 4:59 pm

Re: The Yes 4 Minneapolis charter amendment, explained

Post by gounion »

bradman wrote: Wed Dec 01, 2021 6:06 pm [bold] Murder means premeditation. Yanez did not plan on shooting Castile that day.

The best i can tell ya, Yanez should never have been a cop. And i'd be willing to bet ya his training records show it.
I thought you were for facts first. Guess only some of the time.

Cop asks man if he has any weapons in the car. He has his girlfriend and her four-year-old in the car. He tells the cop he has a duly registered firearm in the car, which he lawfully possesses. The cop pulls the gun and unloads seven shots into a car with a four-year-old in it. Five hit Castile. Of course, they arrested the girlfriend.

Yanez was charged with second-degree manslaughter and two counts of dangerous discharge of a firearm. He was acquitted of all charges.

Now tell me justice was fucking done. Go ahead, Brad. I fucking dare you.
bradman
Posts: 2518
Joined: Mon Oct 25, 2021 10:03 am
Location: Home of the DFL

Re: The Yes 4 Minneapolis charter amendment, explained

Post by bradman »

gounion wrote: Wed Dec 01, 2021 6:42 pm I thought you were for facts first. Guess only some of the time.

Cop asks man if he has any weapons in the car. He has his girlfriend and her four-year-old in the car. He tells the cop he has a duly registered firearm in the car, which he lawfully possesses. The cop pulls the gun and unloads seven shots into a car with a four-year-old in it. Five hit Castile. Of course, they arrested the girlfriend.

Yanez was charged with second-degree manslaughter and two counts of dangerous discharge of a firearm. He was acquitted of all charges.

Now tell me justice was fucking done. Go ahead, Brad. I fucking dare you.
i know most of the details.

Did i mention that i would have been satisfied with manslaughter?

The sooner new recruits know they will be held accountable for such mistakes the sooner we get a police force we desire.

If you don't have the cool, you need not apply.
I am not a member of any organized political party. I am a Democrat. [Will Rogers]
User avatar
carmenjonze
Posts: 9614
Joined: Mon Oct 25, 2021 3:06 am

Re: The Yes 4 Minneapolis charter amendment, explained

Post by carmenjonze »

bradman wrote: Wed Dec 01, 2021 8:43 pmDid i mention that i would have been satisfied with manslaughter?
Not good enough. Try harder.
The sooner new recruits know they will be held accountable for such mistakes the sooner we get a police force we desire.
Murdering Philando Castile was not a mere “mistake.” Giving cops this kind of free pass ensures that the status quo stays the status quo, which is the goal of so-called moderates.

You’re not fooling anyone as the fence sitter who consistently throws in with killer cops.
________________________________

The way to right wrongs is to
Shine the light of truth on them.

~ Ida B. Wells
________________________________
gounion
Posts: 17051
Joined: Sun Oct 24, 2021 4:59 pm

Re: The Yes 4 Minneapolis charter amendment, explained

Post by gounion »

bradman wrote: Wed Dec 01, 2021 8:43 pm i know most of the details.

Did i mention that i would have been satisfied with manslaughter?

The sooner new recruits know they will be held accountable for such mistakes the sooner we get a police force we desire.

If you don't have the cool, you need not apply.
You still cannot explain why he was acquitted of manslaughter charges.

They KNOW they won't be held accountable for mistakes. That's the reality you pay no attention to.

Don't pretend otherwise.
bradman
Posts: 2518
Joined: Mon Oct 25, 2021 10:03 am
Location: Home of the DFL

Re: The Yes 4 Minneapolis charter amendment, explained

Post by bradman »

gounion wrote: Thu Dec 02, 2021 3:58 am You still cannot explain why he was acquitted of manslaughter charges.

They KNOW they won't be held accountable for mistakes. That's the reality you pay no attention to.

Don't pretend otherwise.
[bold] Nothing could be further from the truth.
I am not a member of any organized political party. I am a Democrat. [Will Rogers]
gounion
Posts: 17051
Joined: Sun Oct 24, 2021 4:59 pm

Re: The Yes 4 Minneapolis charter amendment, explained

Post by gounion »

bradman wrote: Thu Dec 02, 2021 10:03 am [bold] Nothing could be further from the truth.
The explain how the cop walked. I'm waiting.
Bludogdem
Posts: 2054
Joined: Sun Oct 24, 2021 5:16 pm

Re: The Yes 4 Minneapolis charter amendment, explained

Post by Bludogdem »

“After five days and more than 25 hours of deliberation, the 12-member jury decided that the state had not met its burden for a conviction. The vote was initially 10–2 in favor of acquitting Yanez; after further deliberation the two remaining jurors were also swayed to acquit.[87] The jury consisted of seven men and five women. Two jurors were black.[87] Following the acquittal, a jury member told the press that the specific wording of the law regarding culpable negligence was the main factor among many leading to the verdict.[88] One juror who later spoke anonymously said:

What we were looking at was some pretty obscure things to a lot of people, like culpable negligence. You think you might know what it means: It's negligent, but maybe pretty bad negligence. Well, it's gross negligence with an element of recklessness ... We had the law in front of us so we could break it down.

It just came down to us not being able to see what was going on in the car. Some of us were saying that there was some recklessness there, but that didn't stick because we didn't know what escalated the situation: was he really seeing a gun? We felt [Yanez] was an honest guy ... and in the end, we had to go on his word, and that's what it came down to.[89]”

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Killing_o ... do_Castile

A jury of 12 rational people in a very difficult situation.

“ Minnesota judge backs jurors who acquitted officer of black motorist's death”

“As we discussed when we met shortly after the verdict, I cannot convey my own opinions as to guilt or acquittal, but your verdict was fully supported by a fair interpretation of the evidence and the law you were obligated to apply,” the newspaper quoted Leary as saying.”


https://www.reuters.com/article/us-minn ... SKBN19P2NE
gounion
Posts: 17051
Joined: Sun Oct 24, 2021 4:59 pm

Re: The Yes 4 Minneapolis charter amendment, explained

Post by gounion »

Bludogdem wrote: Thu Dec 02, 2021 5:22 pm “After five days and more than 25 hours of deliberation, the 12-member jury decided that the state had not met its burden for a conviction. The vote was initially 10–2 in favor of acquitting Yanez; after further deliberation the two remaining jurors were also swayed to acquit.[87] The jury consisted of seven men and five women. Two jurors were black.[87] Following the acquittal, a jury member told the press that the specific wording of the law regarding culpable negligence was the main factor among many leading to the verdict.[88] One juror who later spoke anonymously said:

What we were looking at was some pretty obscure things to a lot of people, like culpable negligence. You think you might know what it means: It's negligent, but maybe pretty bad negligence. Well, it's gross negligence with an element of recklessness ... We had the law in front of us so we could break it down.

It just came down to us not being able to see what was going on in the car. Some of us were saying that there was some recklessness there, but that didn't stick because we didn't know what escalated the situation: was he really seeing a gun? We felt [Yanez] was an honest guy ... and in the end, we had to go on his word, and that's what it came down to.[89]”

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Killing_o ... do_Castile

A jury of 12 rational people in a very difficult situation.

“ Minnesota judge backs jurors who acquitted officer of black motorist's death”

“As we discussed when we met shortly after the verdict, I cannot convey my own opinions as to guilt or acquittal, but your verdict was fully supported by a fair interpretation of the evidence and the law you were obligated to apply,” the newspaper quoted Leary as saying.”


https://www.reuters.com/article/us-minn ... SKBN19P2NE
Who you going to believe, the cop or your lying eyes?

You see, when you say these murders are justified, you make my point. Cops can do anything they want. If they want to blow someone away in front of a four-year-old, then he had damned good reason, right?
gounion
Posts: 17051
Joined: Sun Oct 24, 2021 4:59 pm

Re: The Yes 4 Minneapolis charter amendment, explained

Post by gounion »

Bludogdem wrote: Thu Dec 02, 2021 5:22 pm “After five days and more than 25 hours of deliberation, the 12-member jury decided that the state had not met its burden for a conviction. The vote was initially 10–2 in favor of acquitting Yanez; after further deliberation the two remaining jurors were also swayed to acquit.[87] The jury consisted of seven men and five women. Two jurors were black.[87] Following the acquittal, a jury member told the press that the specific wording of the law regarding culpable negligence was the main factor among many leading to the verdict.[88] One juror who later spoke anonymously said:

What we were looking at was some pretty obscure things to a lot of people, like culpable negligence. You think you might know what it means: It's negligent, but maybe pretty bad negligence. Well, it's gross negligence with an element of recklessness ... We had the law in front of us so we could break it down.

It just came down to us not being able to see what was going on in the car. Some of us were saying that there was some recklessness there, but that didn't stick because we didn't know what escalated the situation: was he really seeing a gun? We felt [Yanez] was an honest guy ... and in the end, we had to go on his word, and that's what it came down to.[89]”

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Killing_o ... do_Castile

A jury of 12 rational people in a very difficult situation.

“ Minnesota judge backs jurors who acquitted officer of black motorist's death”

“As we discussed when we met shortly after the verdict, I cannot convey my own opinions as to guilt or acquittal, but your verdict was fully supported by a fair interpretation of the evidence and the law you were obligated to apply,” the newspaper quoted Leary as saying.”


https://www.reuters.com/article/us-minn ... SKBN19P2NE
Next I"m sure you will justify why this cop shot a man in a wheelchair nine times - IN THE BACK!
gounion
Posts: 17051
Joined: Sun Oct 24, 2021 4:59 pm

Re: The Yes 4 Minneapolis charter amendment, explained

Post by gounion »

Go ahead, GreenGrass, tell me why there is no problem with police:
A Minnesota sheriff has broken his profession’s code of silence to blast the Minneapolis Police Department, saying he’s “disgusted” at the agency’s reportedly violent practices and calling for an overhaul of the agency from the “top down.”

At a Wednesday meeting of an advisory council to the state’s Peace Officer Standards and Training (POST) board, Sheriff Sean Deringer of Wright County unloaded on Minneapolis cops who were caught on their own body cameras allegedly “hunting” protesters in the wake of the murder of George Floyd in 2020. ”I was absolutely disgusted watching that,” Deringer said, adding, “I have defended that agency for the very last time.”

In an extended rant, Derringer apologized to members of the advisory board: He said he was wrong to have dismissed public complaints that Minneapolis Police Department had been reportedly randomly shooting nonviolent protesters with beanbag rounds, pepper balls, flash grenades, and other less lethal munitions. He said his earlier reaction had been to defend his brothers in blue, making comments like: “Holy crap, everyone, that doesn’t happen. Cops do not do that.” But, then, Deringer said, he saw “bodycam footage of Minneapolis Police Department again making headlines. Because why? That’s exactly what they were doing!”

The Minneapolis PD did not respond to a request for comment. Neither did Jacob Frey, the mayor and civilian leader of the police, who has previously called the videos “galling” and “antithetical to the department we are striving to build.”

The footage of Minneapolis cops allegedly “hunting” protesters showed cops being directed to target protesters and “Fuck ‘em up.” The videos captured cops high-fiving after shooting nonviolent protesters with less-lethal impact rounds. Other cops used the same weapons in a manner that resembled a drive-by shooting, firing on people on the street, seemingly unannounced, from an unmarked van.

The footage of the misconduct only became public because cops fired on a protester named Jaleel Stallings, who thought he was under assault and fired back live rounds at the cops with his legally carried gun. (No one was hit.) Stallings was changed with attempted murder, but a jury this summer found he had acted in self-defense. The bodycam footage, used as evidence in his trial, was released to the media by Stallings’ lawyer. Stallings has also filed a civil suit alleging “evil intent” and an “malicious pattern of force” by the Minneapolis PD.

Wright, whose county is part of the Minneapolis metro area and neighbors Hennepin county, which encompasess Minneapolis, said he disagreed with a recent ballot proposition (voted down by Minneapolis residents) “to completely dismantle the police department.” But nonetheless called for sweeping reform: “I’m telling you, from the top down, that agency needs an overhaul.” Deringer added that the Minnesota Sheriffs Association was “ready to write a letter saying we absolutely denounce whatever is going on with the Minneapolis Police Department.”

Mixing in words like “pissed” and “infuriated,” Deringer said, “I am appalled by the lack of leadership in that agency,” because agencies across the state are “all cast in the same barrel of crap coming out of Minneapolis proper.”

Noting that two of his own officers were currently on leave, Deringer recognized that there are “issues” in every department in Minnesota. But “generally speaking,” he insisted, “law enforcement across the state hold themselves to such a much higher standard.”

Referring to the “hunting” videos, he added: “All 160 of my cops understand that they did something like that, they would fully anticipate that they would be fired.”

“I don’t need a criminal finding that they’ve shot somebody without cause with a beanbag round,” Deringer said. “I would kick them to the curb faster than you can imagine.”
User avatar
carmenjonze
Posts: 9614
Joined: Mon Oct 25, 2021 3:06 am

Re: The Yes 4 Minneapolis charter amendment, explained

Post by carmenjonze »

Thing is about these white cons is that for them, no, it is not a problem that the police get away with murdering Black, Latino, and Native American people.

It just is not a problem for them; qualified immunity is not a problem for them. It would be a problem if the cops didn't. It's why they support white-nationalist vigilantes like Kyle Rittenhouse.
________________________________

The way to right wrongs is to
Shine the light of truth on them.

~ Ida B. Wells
________________________________
bradman
Posts: 2518
Joined: Mon Oct 25, 2021 10:03 am
Location: Home of the DFL

Re: The Yes 4 Minneapolis charter amendment, explained

Post by bradman »

Not bad coming from a sheriff serving in Wright County..... Which went overwhelmingly Trump.

Wright County may be able to write themselves of as being part of the Twin Cities but in fact they are somewhere between the border of suburbia and the rural country.
It's white as white can be.
Where white flight moves to i guess you could say.
I am not a member of any organized political party. I am a Democrat. [Will Rogers]
User avatar
carmenjonze
Posts: 9614
Joined: Mon Oct 25, 2021 3:06 am

Re: The Yes 4 Minneapolis charter amendment, explained

Post by carmenjonze »

bradman wrote: Fri Dec 03, 2021 5:15 pm Not bad coming from a sheriff serving in Wright County..... Which went overwhelmingly Trump.

Wright County may be able to write themselves of as being part of the Twin Cities but in fact they are somewhere between the border of suburbia and the rural country.
It's white as white can be.
Where white flight moves to i guess you could say.
He's not owed anything for stating facts about MPD.

I notice you're also always silent on posts about whistleblower officers who are not white.

You should be more honest that you're more concerned with rehabilitating the image of conservative whites like the Trump people of this suburb than paying attention to what this person is actually saying about your PD's violent policies.
________________________________

The way to right wrongs is to
Shine the light of truth on them.

~ Ida B. Wells
________________________________
gounion
Posts: 17051
Joined: Sun Oct 24, 2021 4:59 pm

Re: The Yes 4 Minneapolis charter amendment, explained

Post by gounion »

bradman wrote: Fri Dec 03, 2021 5:15 pm Not bad coming from a sheriff serving in Wright County..... Which went overwhelmingly Trump.

Wright County may be able to write themselves of as being part of the Twin Cities but in fact they are somewhere between the border of suburbia and the rural country.
It's white as white can be.
Where white flight moves to i guess you could say.
I hadn't heard about what these cops had done. Every damned one of them should be in prison for assault against those protesters.

And that department is beyond the ability to reform. Sorry, but the "tear it down" folks had it right.
User avatar
Libertas
Posts: 6468
Joined: Sun Oct 24, 2021 5:16 pm

Re: The Yes 4 Minneapolis charter amendment, explained

Post by Libertas »

gounion wrote: Fri Dec 03, 2021 6:55 pm I hadn't heard about what these cops had done. Every damned one of them should be in prison for assault against those protesters.

And that department is beyond the ability to reform. Sorry, but the "tear it down" folks had it right.
Every law enforcement person in America, from the US Marshals and FBI down to local city police must all be fired and rehired, if they can qualify, using a new system.

YOu do it over a 5 year period, so there is no shortage of police.

Before you start you develop a national curriculum that is heavy on not being racist and not likely to go directly to violence in any given situation. Weed out the racists as best as you can, as we know MANY current police were hired BECAUSE they are racist.
I sigh in your general direction.
Bludogdem
Posts: 2054
Joined: Sun Oct 24, 2021 5:16 pm

Re: The Yes 4 Minneapolis charter amendment, explained

Post by Bludogdem »

gounion wrote: Thu Dec 02, 2021 5:36 pm Who you going to believe, the cop or your lying eyes?

You see, when you say these murders are justified, you make my point. Cops can do anything they want. If they want to blow someone away in front of a four-year-old, then he had damned good reason, right?
That’s a lie. I didn’t say it was justified. Typical lie. Just made up out of whole cloth.

I simply showed why there wasn’t a guilty verdict.
gounion
Posts: 17051
Joined: Sun Oct 24, 2021 4:59 pm

Re: The Yes 4 Minneapolis charter amendment, explained

Post by gounion »

Bludogdem wrote: Fri Dec 03, 2021 10:18 pm That’s a lie. I didn’t say it was justified. Typical lie. Just made up out of whole cloth.

I simply showed why there wasn’t a guilty verdict.
It was a not guilty verdict because the system is corrupted to let murderous cops go, and you're fine with that.
bradman
Posts: 2518
Joined: Mon Oct 25, 2021 10:03 am
Location: Home of the DFL

Re: The Yes 4 Minneapolis charter amendment, explained

Post by bradman »

gounion wrote: Fri Dec 03, 2021 6:55 pm I hadn't heard about what these cops had done. Every damned one of them should be in prison for assault against those protesters.

And that department is beyond the ability to reform. Sorry, but the "tear it down" folks had it right.
Unfortunately, the abolish the police department referendum failed. We lost that battle. Now, we can cry over spilled milk, or, we can refocus on the war. i'm inclined to focus on the second option.
I am not a member of any organized political party. I am a Democrat. [Will Rogers]
User avatar
carmenjonze
Posts: 9614
Joined: Mon Oct 25, 2021 3:06 am

Re: The Yes 4 Minneapolis charter amendment, explained

Post by carmenjonze »

bradman wrote: Sat Dec 04, 2021 9:07 am Unfortunately, the abolish the police department referendum failed. We lost that battle. Now, we can cry over spilled milk, or, we can refocus on the war. i'm inclined to focus on the second option.
What war are you referring to?

I'm guessing you don't mean the war to stop police brutality and get them to quit murdering unarmed people, shooting them in the back, and crying about fearing for their lives?
________________________________

The way to right wrongs is to
Shine the light of truth on them.

~ Ida B. Wells
________________________________
User avatar
Libertas
Posts: 6468
Joined: Sun Oct 24, 2021 5:16 pm

Re: The Yes 4 Minneapolis charter amendment, explained

Post by Libertas »

carmenjonze wrote: Sat Dec 04, 2021 12:42 pm What war are you referring to?

I'm guessing you don't mean the war to stop police brutality and get them to quit murdering unarmed people, shooting them in the back, and crying about fearing for their lives?
Rare occasion where I have read what they said, it was in your response.

I am quite curious to this answer also.
I sigh in your general direction.
bradman
Posts: 2518
Joined: Mon Oct 25, 2021 10:03 am
Location: Home of the DFL

Re: The Yes 4 Minneapolis charter amendment, explained

Post by bradman »

Libertas wrote: Sat Dec 04, 2021 12:46 pm Rare occasion where I have read what they said, it was in your response.

I am quite curious to this answer also.
You can ask me if ya want to.
I am not a member of any organized political party. I am a Democrat. [Will Rogers]
User avatar
carmenjonze
Posts: 9614
Joined: Mon Oct 25, 2021 3:06 am

Re: The Yes 4 Minneapolis charter amendment, explained

Post by carmenjonze »

bradman wrote: Sat Dec 04, 2021 1:01 pm You can ask me if ya want to.
I've already asked you.

What "war" are you referring to?

Care to answer?
________________________________

The way to right wrongs is to
Shine the light of truth on them.

~ Ida B. Wells
________________________________
User avatar
carmenjonze
Posts: 9614
Joined: Mon Oct 25, 2021 3:06 am

Re: The Yes 4 Minneapolis charter amendment, explained

Post by carmenjonze »

Huh. Well.

Minneapolis police chief who oversaw department through the turmoil of George Floyd’s murder to retire - WP

Sucks to be a Blatinx cop and chief of police in the middle of worldwide unrest over some crap your officers pulled, I guess.

He'll land on his feet. No need to fret about him. And if WSs like Glennfs attack him on the basis of race for being a Black chief of police like he does others, I will defend him on that basis.
________________________________

The way to right wrongs is to
Shine the light of truth on them.

~ Ida B. Wells
________________________________
User avatar
carmenjonze
Posts: 9614
Joined: Mon Oct 25, 2021 3:06 am

Re: The Yes 4 Minneapolis charter amendment, explained

Post by carmenjonze »

bradman wrote: Sat Dec 04, 2021 1:01 pm You can ask me if ya want to.
What war are you talking about?
________________________________

The way to right wrongs is to
Shine the light of truth on them.

~ Ida B. Wells
________________________________
Post Reply